chainsaw licence out of date?

[Buzzsurgeon]

I couldn't possibly comment on hangers Though it's how you deal with them that counts (that's my excuse nd I'm standing by it!)

 

This is what we should all be aspiring to speed wise to make a proper wage i the woods

 

 

 

Lets get a load of old chairs off ebay turn em upside down and get practicing!!

[Spruce Pirate]

Absolutely - but it comes back to these college qualifications that are supposedly forestry and arb but they don't get taught any practical hands on forestry.

 

Does seem that we've gone a bit off topic though

 

Couldn't agree more - had two recently qualified lads start in the last year. Told each to cut 3m down to 12cm - totally blank looks, no idea what I was on about, had to explain about lengths and top diametres.

 

To go slightly back to topic, one of these is now getting quite good and looking to do more tickets, the other hasn't picked up a saw in probably 9 months. The worrying thing about this is that in my world he has a ticket and so clients will accept him as a cutter, despite being extremely lacking in experience, on the other hand, if I take on a cutter qualified in 1995 who has not been refreshed since they will not.

 

This seems crazy to me, but that seems to be the world we live in.:thumbdown:

[MATTMOSS]

Hi. Beenlurking for some time, now its time to ask!

 

Did my chainsaw course before i even picked up a chainsaw as i wanted to be safe, and legal. Did that in 1995.

Certificate does not have an expiry on it, and never been asked for it (i am a landscaper not a tree surgeon)

I recently contacted my local council to ask if i could access some land to clear a fallen ash bough (for firewood). no charge to the council.

they asked for my licence, so i emailed a copy.

he said it was not accepted as it was out of date, and did not show cs30 and cs31.

my cert shows assessments 10 and 16.

I phoned nptc who said it was valid, just a change of numbers (6 months after i did the course!), and my insurance company said i was covered. He still wont accept this. he says NPTC are wrong, and he is right!

I queried if he checked all his tree work contractors , and thier employers,as i know some of them DO NOT have this new certificate

just wondered what you guys thought about all this. seems a bit unfair especially when its costing the council nothing, and i have insurance too!

 

Hi Dan,

I'm trying my best to give you a difinitive answer, so here goes:

 

You did your course in 1995 and the assessments were then NPTC 10 and 16, but NPTC WAS the AWARDING BODY and although they renamed the qualification to CS 30,31 they are the same and are still valid.

I believe if you did any further refresher couse or any other further CS unit, your NPTC card would be automatically updated to the newer classification.

You may even be able to send your certificate in and update it to a new photo card to get this done anyway?

 

when I said

 

Ive just spoken to someone who knows a bit about this and they said, that if you have passed your certificate years ago under a different awarding body, when it changed to nptc they gave you grandfather rights, if you registered with them, however if you did not register with the new awarding body, then your qualifacation would expire at a set cut off point.

 

This refers to if you passed your chainsaw certificate prior to 1993 (not 100%sure of year)and FASTCo were the awarding body, then they honored your certification for a set period after NPTC came in, but if you didnt register with NPTC before that cut off point, then it would expire and you would have to do it again under NPTC.

This is the only way you could have a chainsaw certificate that has expired.

 

NPTC qualifications are valid for life - however, it is recomended that you take refresher every five years. And some insurance companies may require

evidence that you are taking steps to update your skills to be sure that you will be covered by your insurance.

 

But as I said earlier:

My understanding of the situation is that you are qualified! This is something I have looked into (refresher courses)and I was told that you would only need a refresher course if you have not used a saw for years and was totally out of practice and not aware of the latest recomendations.

If you pass your chainsaw test and you are a competent, regular user then why would you need a refresher course unless something drastic had changed?

 

As Desertrat said:

In your case if nptc, being the governing body say's it fine then its fine. maybe you should get the person you asked at nptc to call this guy and explain or send an email saying your qual'd up and are good to go.

 

Thats got to work if they would do it.

 

Hope this confirms what you already think, just letting you know the information I could gather.

hope you get to do the job.

regards

Matt

[HCR]

Hi Dan,

I'm trying my best to give you a difinitive answer, so here goes:

 

You did your course in 1995 and the assessments were then NPTC 10 and 16, but NPTC WAS the AWARDING BODY and although they renamed the qualification to CS 30,31 they are the same and are still valid.

I believe if you did any further refresher couse or any other further CS unit, your NPTC card would be automatically updated to the newer classification.

You may even be able to send your certificate in and update it to a new photo card to get this done anyway?

 

when I said

 

Ive just spoken to someone who knows a bit about this and they said, that if you have passed your certificate years ago under a different awarding body, when it changed to nptc they gave you grandfather rights, if you registered with them, however if you did not register with the new awarding body, then your qualifacation would expire at a set cut off point.

 

This refers to if you passed your chainsaw certificate prior to 1993 (not 100%sure of year)and FASTCo were the awarding body, then they honored your certification for a set period after NPTC came in, but if you didnt register with NPTC before that cut off point, then it would expire and you would have to do it again under NPTC.

This is the only way you could have a chainsaw certificate that has expired.

 

NPTC qualifications are valid for life - however, it is recomended that you take refresher every five years. And some insurance companies may require

evidence that you are taking steps to update your skills to be sure that you will be covered by your insurance.

 

But as I said earlier:

My understanding of the situation is that you are qualified! This is something I have looked into (refresher courses)and I was told that you would only need a refresher course if you have not used a saw for years and was totally out of practice and not aware of the latest recomendations.

If you pass your chainsaw test and you are a competent, regular user then why would you need a refresher course unless something drastic had changed?

 

As Desertrat said:

In your case if nptc, being the governing body say's it fine then its fine. maybe you should get the person you asked at nptc to call this guy and explain or send an email saying your qual'd up and are good to go.

 

Thats got to work if they would do it.

 

Hope this confirms what you already think, just letting you know the information I could gather.

hope you get to do the job.

regards

Matt

 

Thank you, that agrees with what I said.

 

My original test (NPTC, but pre plastic cards) was in 1995 on the old unit numbers. A later refresher (post plastic cards) meant I was issued a card that has both the old unit numbers and the new ones on the back.

[Dan Earp]

Thank you, that agrees with what I said.

 

My original test (NPTC, but pre plastic cards) was in 1995 on the old unit numbers. A later refresher (post plastic cards) meant I was issued a card that has both the old unit numbers and the new ones on the back.

 

so youre good to go then, id try that guy once more and if hes difficult ask to speak to his boss

[Topcat]

I got all my certs of comp's back in the early 90's when I was a Fastco instructor and Nptc assesor and they are all still in paper form with the old numbers.ie 10.16.20.21.22. I work most days and feel a lot more confident with a saw now than what I was back then. At present the certs are for life and any old units can be cross checked with the up to date ones. When I last spoke to the NPTC they said that for a small fee they will issue me with a new plastic card with all my old units converted to new but they were not bothered either way. If you have lost your old certs then they will charge £30 extra to search their data base.

 

By the sounds of things it's the guy at the council who needs a refresher course

[Chris Sheppard]

Lets get a load of old chairs off ebay turn em upside down and get practicing!!

t we need is a nice big block of hairy spruce to get stuck into

[dig-dug-dan]

thanks everyone so much for their replies, and especially to mattmoss.

 

here is an email i recieved from gity and guilds (the nptc people) which i have forwarded on to the guy at the council:

 

Good morning Daniel,

 

 

 

Thank you for your email enquiry. I can confirm that NPTC Certificates of Competence in Chainsaw have no expiry date and are valid for life, though we do recommend refresher training. If our qualifications expired they could clearly show an expiry date on them.

 

 

 

Unit CS10 is the maintenance of the chainsaw and CS16 is crosscutting. If I were to equate the units you hold to ‘current’ units it would equate to CS30.1 and CS30.2, please note that scheme criteria changes over the years and will not be exactly the same.

 

 

 

The chainsaw units are to be updated shortly and we will be doing away with the prefix ‘CS’ codes. I would recommend to your local council to concentrate on the unit description rather than worry about the unit number. Particularly as the units have changed over the years; for example CS32 medium tree fell, used to have an upper limit of 760mm. CS32 now has no upper limit and CS33 (large tree fell over 760mm) is no longer offered. I mention this only to highlight that to keep up to date with current industry standards and best practice our qualifications are updated every couple of years which may result in changes to qualification unit numbers. I fear that if older (and still valid) units are not being recognised many experience chainsaw users are being refused work.

 

 

 

I hope my response is of help to you but if I can be of any further assistance please do not hesitate to contact me.

 

 

The annoying thing about all this is, about a year ago i rang the guy at the council to report some rogue tree cutters, cutting a tree in council woodland for a householder, who dumped all the logs in a heap. He never came out to look, and later said i could take the logs. no questions were asked.

Now i want to do the same, remove some ash ( a sizeable bit for firewood), free of charge to the council, and he wants all this info.

He has even said my insurance is not enough, as i need £5 million. So i upped it today (for £19) and emailed him a new cert.

 

If he still drags his feet, i'm not sure what to do next, but i think i can lift the log out in one with my avant.

on another note, how do you report someone for not having a chanisaw licence? the hse website is useless!

[Topcat]

It's not a licence.It's a cert of competence and no one has to have one. Most employers,contract and site managers won't let you work unless you have one. I have a NPTC for 360 digger but can't get work on a building site unless I also have a CPCS.

 

That said it's the first thing the HSE will ask for if they hear about an accident with a chainsaw. They work on, because you can get them it may have been prevented had you had one.

 

Best just ring the HSE and mention no PTO gaurd that will get them running to site..lol

[davess1402]

Quick question we have also encountered this via trying to get access to forest to cut down harvested wood to a manageable size, completed CS30 & CS31 in 2012, any info advice much appreciated..