the euro treaty !!

[Mark James]

He has no say in nothing now, he didn't try and negotiate can't see how it can help.

 

Tom the city makes 10% of GDP it's a spit in the ocean so the massive scale you speak of isn't really true is it.

 

The UK has no money, it only has us, the worker bees paying into the system to keep it going.

 

Don't believe the hype.

[easy-lift guy]

He has no say in nothing now, he didn't try and negotiate can't see how it can help.

 

Tom the city makes 10% of GDP it's a spit in the ocean so the massive scale you speak of isn't really true is it.

 

The UK has no money, it only has us, the worker bees paying into the system to keep it going.

 

Don't believe the hype.

As long as there will be elected officials willing to show they have a back bone and do the right thing for the voters there will always be a chance to reverse course, direction. Mr Cameron exercised his Veto on behalf of the UK. Simply because he decided not to join in lock step over the cliff with the rest of the EU means he is negotiating.

easy-lift guy

[WorcsWuss]

I'm with DC on this.

1. The problems with banks I believe actually started in the US with their sub-prime mortgage collapse.

2. The UK banking industry is a world leader and honestly, it's the most successful industry we have at the moment.

3. Europe is going to become an ever smaller buyer of premium [uK] products as their economies collapse, I've no doubt that pretty soon we'll be getting cheap holidays abroad again.

4. The UK manufacturing industry creates a premium product, the volume sales for that are going to be to China, India etc as their economies boom [ironically on the back of the West demanding more cheap goods] and NOT European countries

5. The Euro was a very cynical and shameful attempt to create a super-state to rival the US and it's foundations are not stable enough to allow it to survive. It was put together in a hurry without giving real thought to the implications of how it was arranged.

 

Oh, and yes, the country's debt problems are OUR fault and the previous chancellor's, not really the banks. Interest rates were kept low to stimulate borrow and spend to create the impression of a successful economy, but like Europe, it was not built on sound foundations, it was forced to grow too quickly...

Edited December 10, 2011 by WorcsWuss

[Tom D]

I' not sure what you mean by the "city" The financial services sector is spread across the whole country...

 

 

Personally I think the euro is doomed, at least in its current form, imagine if people in the south west could retire at 55 and those in yorkshire had to work to 68, that is the situation in europe. If it it going to work benefits, retirement ages etc will have to be standardised across the whole eurozone, if it is not seen to be fair then the germans, dutch etc will not accept paying for the greeks and italians to carry on as they are. And if the southern states are expected to adopt the regimes seen in the north of europe then the people won't wear that either. The eurozone will be dogged by political unrest and strikes for years and will probably collapse anyway. We are better off out of it.

[skyhuck]

He has no say in nothing now, he didn't try and negotiate can't see how it can help.

 

Tom the city makes 10% of GDP it's a spit in the ocean so the massive scale you speak of isn't really true is it.

 

The UK has no money, it only has us, the worker bees paying into the system to keep it going.

 

Don't believe the hype.

 

Please send me 10% of your income, after all its a "spit in the ocean"

 

That "spit in the ocean" pays for 1000's of Doctors, nurses, police officers and fire fighters.

 

We have had a fall in growth of less than 5% that has put us in this huge hole, imagine what a fall of 10% would do!!!

 

I hate the financial sector, they are mostly all bent, robbing, scumbags, but we need the income.

Edited December 10, 2011 by skyhuck

[Mark James]

Yes we need it but for that 10% how much inadvertently doe's it cost us?

 

My guess a lot.

[WorcsWuss]

It is a myth that the 'banking sector' costs the country a fortune, we are confusing high street banks [a retail business just like a shop] with commercial banks [the 'city'].

 

High street banks:

Bailed out by the government

Lent money they didn't have to people who couldn't afford to pay it back

Borrowed money they couldn't afford to pay back

Invested very poorly and lost a lot of money

Didn't keep a sufficient pile of 'real cash'

Placed all responsibility for checking credit worthiness in machines rather than intelligent people.

 

Commercial banks:

Are allowed to fail [Like Barings]

Not bailed out by the tax payer

Do not provide private banking

Manage investments of large organisations

Are actually fairly stable

Generate HUGE revenue for the UK

 

The commercial banking sector is in a bit of a pickle because it's trying to generate money to support the high street banks to whom they lend, who need to lend the money to us to buy over priced houses, cars and electrical goods.

 

The 'banking sector proper' does still generate cash for the UK and is NOT a massive drain on our economy.

So when people refer to 'fat cat bankers', they're thinking about the wrong people.

The mythical enemy in the 'banking sector' is actually the guys writing the software which all our financial lives depend on - 'computer says no' - and the very poor HR management of high street banks who have done away with proper bank managers and farmed it all out to cheap call centres in the quest for higher returns for YOU AND I - the shareholders! [i'm not one but we all could be if we wanted]

 

The 'crisis' in the banking sector is NOT down to 'the city' or 'fat cat bankers'... it's down to some very poor decisions regarding the structuring of high street banks staff, the previous 'prudent' chancellor and his suppression of the base rate, and our insatiable appetite for MORE STUFF....

 

The city actually has very little to do with the current situation and needs to be protected, it is the one thing which allows us to maintain our position of importance in the world and if we lose it, what else do we have?

[firewood]

All he is doing is trying to defend the banking sector, the very institution that got us in this mess.

 

Britain has agreed to everything Europe has thrown at it for the last 10 years.

 

So I understand everyone's excitement at Cameron's refusal to agree, but it simply to little to late.

 

 

Sent from my aye phone using Tapatalk

 

The city is a whole lot more than just idiot bankers.

 

http://www.kinnoirwoodfuel.co.uk

[NFG]

IMO in a crisis, Great Britain has teetered before on the brink of joining the Euro at the wrong time for the wrong reasons & once again this is one of them. Its not just the common currency, its all the bull that goes with it thats the big no no. Im sure, that just like 'decimalisation' the price will be rounded up & the change rounded down. Integration with the common currency should have occurred at a much more beneficial price, but GB only seems to consider this option as a last resort when the entry price is wrong.

 

Whilst I respect & support Mr Cameron's decision, I do think some common ground between France, Germany & GB could/should be found and with some clever manipulation an agreement achieved to benefit all.

 

On slightly different notes, I think retail & commercial banking sectors must be split to protect smaller investors, businesses & individuals. To me, its fairly obvious what UK businesses need is more customers which an improved alliance with Europe may provide along with increased monetary supply. You cant give people jobs without more customers, unless you decide to, say re-surface all the roads - which desperately needs doing!

 

I saw all this coming a long time ago, unrealistic market expectations/values based on continuing increases in growth, cleverly massaged statistics reliant on an ever expanding economy. To counter the massive fail, I re-arranged my lifestyle to one more independent & self sufficient, with a diversity of Euro & Sterling incomes and what ever the outcome things wont go wrong.

 

I did consider setting up my own bank, lending and buying debt recklessly, having gone bust, obtain a huge bailout form the taxpayer, award myself a massive bonus & a collection of Stihls to impress!

 

N

 

There have been a number of good posts to this thread, this is my opinion and yours will be different!

Edited December 10, 2011 by NFG