Rope Wrench feedback

[Dan Curtis]

I've been thinking about using an extendable bridge with the wrench. Mainly just for the droopy/weak limbs was the intention. The thinking was if you were to be in a situation where you needed a micro adjustment, without adding weight to the limb, the bridge would be the best point to do it ie. Ddrt style. Any thoughts?

[mistahbenn]

Yes very well put Rupe, these are my concerns too. You put it alot better than I put it. Look fwd to the answers.

[Mark Bolam]

TBH even I just use it for double quick access then switch to Drt for the rest of the climb it wouldn't bother me. It seems a cheap solution for SRT access on it's own.

 

The branch walking thing bothers me though, and I get what Rupe is saying there.

 

I was hoping mine would arrive today, but I'm living in suspense!

 

Carys tip about clipping the Pantin with a crab so it can't kick out is great, can anyone recommend anything smaller than a DMM Sentinel (my favourite crab)?

 

Also, can someone answer Rupes query about the physics of taking weight off the Pantin before advancing? Do you lose the advantage a bit by sit-back on the hitch?

 

Rupe, if you bin yours, bin it my way. I'll buy you a pint at Capel and get a refund from Honeys!

[High Scale]

I'm struggling with it TBH!! Not sure what I am doing wrong but so far I am not convinced but I want to be.

 

I have used it with the spiderjack and that has potential, but as I never really mastered the spiderjack yet I thought I shoud really be using the WR with a hitch for now so I can compare with what I know best.

 

I set a hitch that grabs really well. I found going down the rope and out on limbs to be fantastic, totally get it! But if you need to tension in a fraction, i.e. the limb you are on is bending too much and you just want to tighten your rope, how do you ge the tension off the rope in order to draw slack through without putting more weight on the branch?

 

I know folk have said that the advantage is that you only need to pull in a foot to travel a foot, but it seems to me that the good thing about Ddrt is the micro adjust possibilites where you can go up half an inch by pulling through an inch but maintaining your weight in the sytem as you do so.

 

Also, I get the SRT ascent thing when in free space, thats good, but if your line is against the trunk and your feet are being used to ascend then I find it harder to stop your self swinging left or right.

 

If using one foot with a pantin, how do you take the tension when moving that foot up the rope? i.e. do you sit in the friction hitch?? If so then you lose a few inches everytime you sit and raise your leg again? Is this right? Or are you supposed to hold your weight on your arms while you bring your pantin'd foot back up? My elbows were killing me so maybe thats what I was doing.

 

I still have some way to go with this, but nearly launched it all in the skip last week!!

 

 

OK, I am perhaps one of the biggest cynics when it comes to new claims of climbing greatness and cynical I indeed was when it first came to trying out the RW.

 

I had exactly the same struggles as you Rupe and the reason I think is that after years of climbing Ddrt our brains are hardwired to climb that way.

 

It took me maybe six weeks or more to really get it, rather than pulling in the tail of your rope as in Ddrt to slightly adjust your position you instead move your whole body and quickly adjust by pulling in the slack by moving your rope from below and forward pushing your hitch towards your TIP.

 

If you are advancing up the rope when you are close to the tree stick your spare leg out against the trunk to steady yourself, as for advancing up the rope with a Pantin it's all about the rhythm, you push off with your leg, grab then lock your arms, then raise your climbing leg and push down and then repeat, you shouldn't need to pull up with your arms, just use them to lock on.

 

Use your legs to push up and let them do the hard work.

 

I don't want to tell any of you very experienced climbers how to suck eggs I just hope I can help in any little way I can.

Edited February 18, 2012 by High Scale

[Old Mill Tree Care]

[quote=Rupe;628845]I'm struggling with it TBH!! Not sure what I am doing wrong but so far I am not convinced but I want to be.

 

I have used it with the spiderjack and that has potential, but as I never really mastered the spiderjack yet I thought I shoud really be using the WR with a hitch for now so I can compare with what I know best.

 

I set a hitch that grabs really well. I found going down the rope and out on limbs to be fantastic, totally get it! But if you need to tension in a fraction, i.e. the limb you are on is bending too much and you just want to tighten your rope, how do you ge the tension off the rope in order to draw slack through without putting more weight on the branch?

 

It's tricky to explain. It is a bit unnerving at first as for years you've been climbing by applying all your weight to your rope. Now you have to 'walk the branch' and get the weight off the rope a bit to come in. It just takes some practice. For the really long skinny branches put a RADS in but I'll bet that, as I did, you'll soon get through it and not need the RADS.

 

 

I know folk have said that the advantage is that you only need to pull in a foot to travel a foot, but it seems to me that the good thing about Ddrt is the micro adjust possibilites where you can go up half an inch by pulling through an inch but maintaining your weight in the sytem as you do so.

As your SRT technique/style develops you'll notice that you will be thinking ahead a great deal more so that you don't get into a position where you have to make micro adjustments. I've noticed that I now generally have a more upright work position and as a result my weight is on my legs and because I'm not leaning out so much, my torso isn't twisted as much. The result is less physical stress. It's a smarter and more productive style as I'm doing less 'tweaking' of my position.

 

 

Also, I get the SRT ascent thing when in free space, thats good, but if your line is against the trunk and your feet are being used to ascend then I find it harder to stop your self swinging left or right.

 

Do you remember learning to hip thrust on DRT and the tendency was to swing side to side. This is exactly the same and I bet after another six trees you'll be smooth as butter.

 

 

If using one foot with a pantin, how do you take the tension when moving that foot up the rope? i.e. do you sit in the friction hitch?? If so then you lose a few inches everytime you sit and raise your leg again? Is this right? Or are you supposed to hold your weight on your arms while you bring your pantin'd foot back up? My elbows were killing me so maybe thats what I was doing.

 

Don't hold your weight on your arms, set your hitch so it is really short to minimise sit back. Push on your Pantin, at the same time slide your hitch up with one hand while the other hand is on the rope above purely for balance. If the ascent is slightly longer put an ascender up, if the ascent is even longer put the foot loop on as well. Also, take small steps as this will reduce upsetting your balance until your confidence grows.

Regarding the sit back: it's actually a non issue because you are still gaining more height for less effort than is possible on DRT.

 

 

I still have some way to go with this, but nearly launched it all in the skip last week!!

 

 

I had the same anxieties as you before I tried it and during the first two trees because I was over thinking it.

You have to adapt to a totally different mindset. You're not on DRT any more so don't try to imitate your old postures and positions as they really won't work.

Go back on this thread and watch Ian Flatters' vid in the tree with Arborholic. Pay attention to how they ascend with just a Pantin. I have my hands in different places as I'm on an HC but essentially the technique is the same.

 

Climb the tree. Climb the tree. Climb the tree.

Edited February 18, 2012 by Old Mill Tree Care
Bad lay out

[Rupe]

Ok, a few points raised.

 

SRT for access, brilliant, but i can do that with the kit I already have, and have been for a while.

 

Then the other problems that have been raised all seem to have solutions which is GREAT. IN addition to the problems I have raised there was also the one of your hitch falling down low and casuing you to fall out of the tree!! This problem was solved by putting your lanyard over your shoulder and cliping it to the HC, GREAT!

 

So, then the problem of micro adjust on bendy limb walks is to add an adjustable bridge! GREAT! (got rid of my adjustable bridge years ago)

 

The Pantin might unclip causing major panic so add another krab there. GREAT.

 

All of these problems have been addressed, GREAT, but none of these problems existed with Ddrt?

 

I like the idea of SRT and simplifying my kit but so far this is not happening, every problem seems to need more kit thrown at it to resolve the issue.

 

I think if we wanted to simplify our kit then a prussik loop and a rope would be the way forward, as was discovered 20+ years ago. Another thing I found the other day while ascending, I had the lanyard over my shoulder thing going on but wanted to stop to cut something, and of course you all know I always lanyard in!! WHeres my lanyard, oh yes, unclip from the HC use it as a LANYARD and then put it back.

 

I like the video posted earlier showing how fast you can switch from ascent to descent, like, in only 5-10 second, well that is 10 seconds too long IMO.

 

Dont get me wrong, I am still intrigued, but in the past I have found the answers by being sceptical and almost forcign others to prove the ideas to me, so I am still happy to be shown the way. RW not in the skip just yet, but e bay is only a few click away.

[High Scale]

Nicely put oldmills.

[Rupe]

Climb the tree. Climb the tree. Climb the tree.

 

I like that idea! I climb the tree whenever possible and take in slack as I go, but on bendy limb walks I dont want to add weight to the branch in order to take slack out, I want to maintain weight at the TIP and micro adjust.

 

For big trees with large ascent between work stations I get it, but I am practicing on small stuff to be sensible and finding I dont have the adjustablity that I am used to.

[High Scale]

It all becomes routine after only a short while, seconds saved means nothing when you're all ready a speedy climber, it's all about the effort you expend and SRT is all about less effort.

[Adam Bourne]

Ok, a few points raised.

 

SRT for access, brilliant, but i can do that with the kit I already have, and have been for a while.

 

Then the other problems that have been raised all seem to have solutions which is GREAT. IN addition to the problems I have raised there was also the one of your hitch falling down low and casuing you to fall out of the tree!! This problem was solved by putting your lanyard over your shoulder and cliping it to the HC, GREAT!

 

So, then the problem of micro adjust on bendy limb walks is to add an adjustable bridge! GREAT! (got rid of my adjustable bridge years ago)

 

The Pantin might unclip causing major panic so add another krab there. GREAT.

 

All of these problems have been addressed, GREAT, but none of these problems existed with Ddrt?

 

I like the idea of SRT and simplifying my kit but so far this is not happening, every problem seems to need more kit thrown at it to resolve the issue.

 

I think if we wanted to simplify our kit then a prussik loop and a rope would be the way forward, as was discovered 20+ years ago. Another thing I found the other day while ascending, I had the lanyard over my shoulder thing going on but wanted to stop to cut something, and of course you all know I always lanyard in!! WHeres my lanyard, oh yes, unclip from the HC use it as a LANYARD and then put it back.

 

I like the video posted earlier showing how fast you can switch from ascent to descent, like, in only 5-10 second, well that is 10 seconds too long IMO.

 

Dont get me wrong, I am still intrigued, but in the past I have found the answers by being sceptical and almost forcign others to prove the ideas to me, so I am still happy to be shown the way. RW not in the skip just yet, but e bay is only a few click away.

 

ha and this is exactly why have not bought one yet.........i've read this thread from back to front, start to finish, upside down inside out and still can't find a valid reason why i would even bother buying one, i just don't see how it could make things simple and quicker.......call me colour blind but i think we maybe going backwards on this one ...... (abuse waiting)