PSA (Peugeot/Citroen) XUD Diesel Engine - How did they get it so right?

[Mesterh]

I think you added another 10mpg on there from what I can see.

 

Quick car though, insurance would also cost a few quid though.

 

What Im saying is diesel motoring clearly isnt what it used to be.

 

You will also find a lot of 320d owners with blown engines due to turbo failure.

[treewizard]

i know of a 205d van with 500,000 miles on, not sure if its the same engine but still good miles!

[TimberCutterDartmoor]

979k miles - damn impressive!!

 

I read a good while back that the recognised highest mileage car still in operation is a 1974 Mercedes 220D operating as a taxi in Athens with a little over 2.8 million miles. Incredible what proper care will get out of an engine!

 

Precisely - proper care! Throwaway generation seems oblivious to something called maintenance! Run an engine in correctly (ignoring the modern idea that it's not needed), don't labour or overrev it, let it tickover before and after moving off, take lubricants and servicing seriously, load the engine correctly and there you have it.

 

I had a 405 with 1.9 naturally aspirated, a 205 D turbo and I've currently got a 406 executive estate with the 2.1 12v turbo. It's amazing how bad they can make an XUD by trying to squeeze another 200cc out of it, would go back to the 1.9 turbo any day.

 

Yeah, that 2.1 went and spoilt it all eh! I don't know if it's just a bored-out 1.9 but that would be tantamount to a reduced water jacket and less block strength etc. Ironically the 1905 wasn't exactly a bored-out 1769 either; it certainly wasn't stroked or the pistons skimmed and yet the block was in miniscule amounts longer...weird...

 

I've three 306s a 406 but favorite was my 205 stdt which had the gti goodwood wheels on it with the grey centers wish I could buy it back now

 

I recently sold a set of the 8-spoke 405/205 STDT wheels to a guy in london who'd bought a 205 Gentry on ebay. He paid £300 for it later realising that tidy ones hovered around the 2-3K mark! I've been thinking of trying to find a tidy '92/93 309 recently - diesels such as the GLDT and GRDT are now rare but those nice green Goodwoods are just that aren't they - nice! Smoked alloys, leather etc etc.

 

I was thinking about this the other day.

 

The only real reasons for buying a diesel were ,

 

1 They were reliable and tuff

 

2 They returned a good mpg.

 

It seems that they arent as economical now as they were in the past. Plus a lot dont get past the 80k mark before blowing a turbo,a head gasket or snapping a cam belt.

 

Makes you wonder if its even worth buying a diesel these days!

 

Lpg seems a better option.

 

The reduced economy is much to do with the crazy power outputs and bonkers torque now standard on diesels - I mean who would imagined an Audi TT quattro with a 2000cc oil burner producing approx 200 brake and bucket loads of grunt?! I had a Golf GT TDI PD 130 and averaged 48mpg over 3 years. I had a sixth gear and I used to drive from Bristol to Glasgow as fast as possible - rugularly at 120mph thru the lake district and the borders. My 65bbhp Pug 309 did 55mpg + but simply couldn't produce that kind of power. All that's happened is that BMEP has gone up and up; that's "brake mean effecive pressure" so efficiency sweet spot (peak torque in a non-throttled engine) gets used and enjoyed!

 

Blown turbos and other parts are always more the blame of the owner rather than the designer. Turbos suffer for lubrication neglect for starters. The hectic rate of diesel development has lead to some very stressed components and as the yanks say there's no substitute for cubic inches. There's a trade off inevitably. Autocar spent a year analysing fuel types and came to the conclusion that diesel or rather compression-ignition is a given; hydrogen can't compare thermodynamically or in life-cycle analysis, gasoline can only improve up to it's thermal efficiency maximum of approaching 40%, spark-ignition engines on lpg, cng etc are even less efficient as a direct result of a low energy-dense fuel, I could go on all night. But diesel engines are inherently efficient due to pure air-only adiabatic compression, the fuel they burn (preferably of vegetable origin or algal synthesis vs dino), the list goes on and on and on. If you want to criticise emissions I'll post you a copy of my PhD thesis. Look only briefly at the life, work and death of Rudolf Diesel and you'll be speechless. It's thermal efficiency and torque mate - petrol engined lorries, trains, plant ??? - doesn't even compare.

 

I've been under the impression that LPG has more or less died a death - if you look on Autotrader, less than 0.1% of vehicles for sale have LPG.

 

Modern diesels seem to be quite extraordinary in terms of combining epic economy and performance. Take the new BMW 535D - 6 seconds to 60 and 45mpg. Why even bother with petrol?

 

Precisely.

 

Here's another example; I own a 3.0 TiD Saab 9-5. The isuzu engine in it was reputed to be one of the most troublesome and unreliable modern diesels out there but I took a risk and bought one. A DMF, engine mountings and tlc later and no probs at all - a world class engine. The ones that haven't had the luxury of motorway life and careful attentive and perhaps intensive owners aree the ones that dropped liners, blew turbos, spat out fuel pumps etc.

 

And one final thing! EGR VALVES! These infernal NOx reducing devices ruin performance, coke up inlet manifolds, wear out inlet valves, reduce mpg and cost the earth to replace. Thankfully my trusty 405 doesn't have one but i have disconnected the ones on the 9-5 and L200 pickup. Wifes Bora is ok for now but de-activating these damned things or blanking them off is the way to go.

Edited January 22, 2011 by TimberCutterDartmoor

[robbo 110]

egr valves etc etc all needed for new vehicles to reach emmisions requirements, clearly they are not good, i have a 205d which is on veg oil, but ive put a fuel heater in-line, makes loads of difference ive found!!!! cracking little engine!!

[18 stoner]

Nice story with your pug TCD.

 

Only one i had was the 205 van, 1.9.

 

Was a works van I was at and the boss cooked it.

 

I bought it at 100k miles and rebuilt her. It was battered all round, not a square panel on it and many shades of blue.

 

I brayed it for the next three years covering a further 60k at over 50mpg. Never put a foot wrong until i rear ended a stationary Omega when I was doing 60. I was trapped in the van but eventually freed by a passer by who was a little smaller than me, then got into the old girl, started her and drove it off the road.

 

I am sure if it werent for this bitter end, that motor would still be running today.

[Lorry thompson]

Aye TCD my mate had a goodwood sue he still has but he fitted 2 lt turbo to it from an old Citroën I think he wishes he'd left it alone now. I'd like a 205 gti before they get too rare maybe with the mi16 engine in. I know sounds a bit boy racer crap but I've always wanted one since a kid.

[Peter]

Interesting stuff TCD, thanks for posting.

[Big J]

I think you added another 10mpg on there from what I can see.

 

Quick car though, insurance would also cost a few quid though.

 

What Im saying is diesel motoring clearly isnt what it used to be.

 

You will also find a lot of 320d owners with blown engines due to turbo failure.

 

46.3mpg according to the official figures, and 5.7 to 60. Might not quite get that in real world situations, but it's nevertheless the car I want if I make millions!

[ScotClayShooter]

A VW Passat BlueMotion has established a brand new Guinness World Record for the longest distance travelled by a standard production passenger vehicle on a single tank of fuel.

 

The attempt, carried out by a team from The Sunday Times, involved driving from Maidstone in Kent to the South of France and back. The Passat BlueMotion finally ran out of fuel close to Calais after completing a distance of 1,526.63 miles.

 

The route mainly followed French autoroutes, but included some town driving, resulting in an average speed of just over 45 mph.

 

Gavin Conway, for The Sunday Times, drove the Passat BlueMotion during the three-day record-breaking trip, accompanied by a navigator and video crew. Two AA patrolmen followed the entire attempt in their van to witness the journey independently for the Guinness World Records organisation, which accredited the record.

 

Powered by a Volkswagen 1.6-litre common rail TDI engine developing 105 PS, the Passat BlueMotion used for the record attempt was a standard production model. In common with the Polo and Golf BlueMotion models, the Passat is fitted with aerodynamic modifications to the bodywork, a lower ride height, Stop/Start, programmed battery charging, longer gearing and low rolling resistance tyres. The result is a vehicle that is completely conventional to drive, service and maintain yet among the most efficient vehicles on the road today.

 

The Passat BlueMotion’s fuel tank was drained before the record breaking journey and filled with 77.25 litres of standard forecourt diesel, resulting in an overall fuel consumption of 89.83 miles per gallon. This substantially exceeds the Passat BlueMotion’s official combined figure of 64.2 mpg. The resulting fuel cost for the journey works out at just 6.17p per mile travelled.

 

In setting the record the Passat BlueMotion travelled a distance equivalent to driving from London to Malaga, without needing to refuel or from New York to Los Angeles with a single stop for diesel.

 

 

 

Read more: VW Passat BlueMotion sets world record for longest distance on single tank of fuel

 

 

 

Now lets bear in mind a Pug 205 diesel weighs about the same as 2 tins of beans lol and the modern cars are heavy with all the strenth built in and safety features, Diesels are getting better and better but Newtons laws involving Mass and acceleration cant be beaten by adding weight.

 

I have a mate that had a 2004 330D BMW that was chipped to 250hp that thing was brutal on acceleration but would give mid 50s to the gallon when treking from Shropshire to Inverness at 80 mph!

[TimberCutterDartmoor]

egr valves etc etc all needed for new vehicles to reach emmisions requirements, clearly they are not good, i have a 205d which is on veg oil, but ive put a fuel heater in-line, makes loads of difference ive found!!!! cracking little engine!!

 

Nice one. Been thinking about those in-line heaters myself since my possible gelling in the 405 fuel fillter housing. It's fine when warmed up as it heats the fuel there but cold starting and weather would definately permit more veg use with a heater; do you have a link to the one you have? Also, does your engine have the lucas or bosch pump? Thanks.