Is it too easy?

[Tree Man Tom]

ive played the casualty a couple of times and quickly realised i stood no chance!

 

the system defo needs an overhaul. the problem is the industry is set in its ways. itl take donkeys years before any changes are noticed.

 

6 months (or any period) isnt great. as a "qualified" arborist ive spent the last 6 months strimming and spraying! and longer just grounding for unqualified idiots who "think" they are tree surgeons. try advising them itl go wrong if that bit is cut first...........standing in the middle of the tree.........no second anchor..........one hand on the climbing rope..........the other hand on the 200t...........

 

Makes me an unqualified idiot then

[john dawson]

in reply to skyhulks question

 

not sure if this counts as a proper rescue

 

i had to rescue someone out of a tree before at college. he was on his lanyard and accidentally dropped his main climbing line and i was sent up to get him down

 

that was good of you to do that.

 

did the person get a ticking off? or was it a role play?

 

this situation is what we mean by adequate training. your ropes (main and secondary) should always be attached to your harness, ie- unclip the bowline/splice and throw over next anchorpoint whilst keeping the friction hitch end clipped to the harness.

[skyhuck]

that was good of you to do that.

 

did the person get a ticking off? or was it a role play?

 

this situation is what we mean by adequate training. your ropes (main and secondary) should always be attached to your harness, ie- unclip the bowline/splice and throw over next anchorpoint whilst keeping the friction hitch end clipped to the harness.

 

Must be great being perfect and never making any mistakes

 

The guy was at collage, learning these things!!!

 

I think its good it happened, I bet no one who was there at the time has ever done it since.

[bob]

I disagree first aid should be a seperate thing aLtogether. My point was more about how someone who has had essentially a crash course in climbing can be classed as an aerial rescuer.

 

will try to explain my thoughts

Aerial rescue teaches them the basics

I would not let a newly passed 38 holder be the person i relied on to be the appointed rescuer

Although legally they can

I would get them up to a standard that satisfied ME

I hear of and see so many folk out there not having a competent rescuer

Thats there choice but often it,s down to cost,s involved in training so make the standards higher and the training will go up

In essence the problem is often folk think they are qualified but very often not competent and usually young lads that think there gods gift to treework

[Stephen Blair]

i worked in trees for over 11 years before getting my tickets and i can't even remember how to tie a bowline since i was shown in November by the instructor, i have never had an accident, yes i have had some scrapes and bruises but thats life. I am in charge of my own actions. Scrap college courses and tickets i say and just let folk look for a job, if they can do it they will stay in the job, if not do something else. I have employed at least 20 folk in 12 years of trading and i have never had to fire anyone, they just leave and go and do something else because it isnt for them, they see the realities of tree work. Hard graft in the rain or ballistics in a day most wear shorts.

[Frank]

will try to explain my thoughts

Aerial rescue teaches them the basics

I would not let a newly passed 38 holder be the person i relied on to be the appointed rescuer

Although legally they can

I would get them up to a standard that satisfied ME

I hear of and see so many folk out there not having a competent rescuer

Thats there choice but often it,s down to cost,s involved in training so make the standards higher and the training will go up

In essence the problem is often folk think they are qualified but very often not competent and usually young lads that think there gods gift to treework

 

This is exactly my thoughts. Thank you Bob.

 

"although legally they can". Why is this so?

 

I'm not trying to change anything. I couldn't actually give a rats arse about anyone elses habits or work ethics or practises. I only work with people I KNOW are competent. I was merely opening up a healthy debate as I've been a bit bored of Arbtalk lately.

 

I like watching newly qualified "arbs" working and then remarking " are you sure they said you passed?" haha winds them up a treat.

 

My thoughts are that the NPTC certs give you a provisional license and then your employer will give you the apprentiship, teaching you the why's and wherefores.

However the current system allows a landscaper to do 3 weeks training and then add "tree surgery" to their sign writing. Enabling them to be fully insured aswell.

[Stephen Blair]

will give you the apprentiship, teaching you the why's and wherefores.

However the current system allows a landscaper to do 3 weeks training and then add "tree surgery" to their sign writing. Enabling them to be fully insured aswell.

Frank that just goes to show that this job is nothing special, the only people who think it is are the ones that think they are better than gardeners. :sneaky2:if you can loose good customers to someone who has just started up with no reputation then you are not doing it right or those customers arent worth keeping.

[Frank]

i worked in trees for over 11 years before getting my tickets and i can't even remember how to tie a bowline since i was shown in November by the instructor, i have never had an accident, yes i have had some scrapes and bruises but thats life. I am in charge of my own actions. Scrap college courses and tickets i say and just let folk look for a job, if they can do it they will stay in the job, if not do something else. I have employed at least 20 folk in 12 years of trading and i have never had to fire anyone, they just leave and go and do something else because it isnt for them, they see the realities of tree work. Hard graft in the rain or ballistics in a day most wear shorts.

 

That's not the point. I'm not talking specifically about having accidents.

 

Before you got your tickets, where you driving around telling people you were a "fully qualified tree surgeon"? No. You were a fully experienced tree cutter. Now you have your tickets, do you call your self a "fully qualified tree surgeon"? No probably not. More likely a tree cutter who is experienced and now on the right side of legislation. My point was more about how easy it is to get a couple of tickets and think your a tree surgeon.

[skyhuck]

So would you have them retested every 6 months Frank????

 

As if they did not climb for 6 months after passing they would soon no longer be up to speed.

 

I say let the commercial pressures police us, the weak soon fail.

[Frank]

Frank that just goes to show that this job is nothing special, the only people who think it is are the ones that think they are better than gardeners. :sneaky2:if you can loose good customers to someone who has just started up with no reputation then you are not doing it right or those customers arent worth keeping.

 

I'm not bothered about loosing jobs to gardeners, I'm not even bothered about having tickets or not. This thread was a talking point for whoever was interested. Not necessarily my true beliefs.