Isc rope grab help

[htb]

10 minutes ago, john87 said:

Were not too good at physics were you.. How many times do i have to say it, FRICTION IS INDEPENDENT OF AREA..

 

john..

Really

[Joe Newton]

52 minutes ago, john87 said:

Brainless prat.. Yep, i can insult people and be abusive as well as anyone else..

 

john..

You don't know what you're talking about. You're whole argument comes from "it didn't feel right in my tummy".

 

I've been climbing for over a decade. Pete has more than double that time under his belt.

 

You might do well to listen to people rather than try and convince everyone that we're wrong with your few weeks experience. 

[Pete Mctree]

You are correct John, friction is not relative to area. However a larger rope will have a different (greater) coefficient of friction (different mass, grip etc), so less force would be required on the cam to hold you up there (let’s just pretend they are identical in every manner but size). This is all really noticeable when you are using them.

So, I still disagree with you - a larger diameter is not an issue as long as it is within the parameters of the device.

 

I think this thread has run its course for me.

[john87]

4 minutes ago, Pete Mctree said:

You are correct John, friction is not relative to area. However a larger rope will have a different (greater) coefficient of friction (different mass, grip etc), so less force would be required on the cam to hold you up there (let’s just pretend they are identical in every manner but size). This is all really noticeable when you are using them.

So, I still disagree with you - a larger diameter is not an issue as long as it is within the parameters of the device.

 

I think this thread has run its course for me.

Hi Pete,

Not a problem disagreeing with me, i like to hear what people think. Besides, you have used more combinations of grab and rope than i ever will. Best of all, you do not resort to getting abusive either!!

 

john..

[john87]

3 hours ago, htb said:

Really

Ok, do not listen to me, after all what do i know, so you google it if you want, [and discover that you are not as clever as you think you are.]

 

john..

[carlos]

hey john87, how long have you been climbing and have you had any formal training?

thanks carl

[john87]

2 hours ago, Joe Newton said:

You don't know what you're talking about. You're whole argument comes from "it didn't feel right in my tummy".

 

I've been climbing for over a decade. Pete has more than double that time under his belt.

 

You might do well to listen to people rather than try and convince everyone that we're wrong with your few weeks experience. 

Yes, as i said, it worked ok, but the thing just did not feel "happy" as it were, [to me at least] so i changed it. This might seem like a backward step to many, but each to his own. A Prusik just felt a better job to me.. and I am not the only one to prefer a friction hitch to rope grabs or other "gadgets"

 

I never said anyone was wrong, i just pointed out that friction was independent of area, which it is..

 

Try your rope grab on a 13mm rope [it will grab and grip instantly and securely[ then on a 13mm wooden dowel [not quite so ready to grab but will grip passably well] then try it on a piece of 13mm silver steel rod [will not grab at all, never mind grip] despite the fact that they all have the same diameter and area.. There you go, area means nothing..

 

Now, when it comes to climbing, yes, you all have VASTLY more experience than me, so of course i listen to you all, i would not be on this forum otherwise.. BUT, that is no reason for people to resort to insults and abuse..

 

Everyone had to start somewhere, and i bet they did not start when they were 60 years old either..

 

I would imagine that EVERYONE on here has more experience than me, but, equally, there are no doubt lots of [non tree related] areas where i have more experience than anyone on here.

 

That does not make me "cleverer" or a "better person" or "superior" or anything, it just means we are different..

 

What it does not do though, is to induce me to be rude or insult others..

 

Someone stated that i was "scared" of my gear. Well, funnily enough, i enjoy climbing. I am not naturally good with heights, stuffed would i go up long ladders for instance, but up a tree, hmm, it is just unique i suppose, different in a way. You do have moments when you think "Ooerrr" but anyone that claims they do not is either a liar or stupid or both.

 

Bits of you that are delicate, hurt a lot when you prod them. That is the process of evolution for you. That is the idea of pain, to stop you hurting yourself. There is a medical condition where people do not feel pain, and they suffer serious injuries as a result. So, you have evolved NOT to climb up trees, as what goes up, comes down etc. So it is natural to feel apprehensive at times, it is your brain doing what it was designed to do, AND more importantly, it is what keeps you safe..

 

Still, i do enjoy it; I like to challenge myself, set goals etc and nothing but NOTHING beats the sense of acheivement when you have been up about 60 feet, [my record up to now!]

 

john..

[john87]

12 minutes ago, carlos said:

hey john87, how long have you been climbing and have you had any formal training?

thanks carl

Only a few months!! I am 60 so it is hard going and at my age will probably not get much easier. No, i have not had any formal training, too old for all that!! I would look a bit odd if i turned up on a training course with a load of 25 year olds, i would not be physically capable of it either i would imagine..

 

I just stop and think carefully what the effect will be, or could be, of anything i do, before i do it!! If i am not sure, then i do not do it..

 

In engineering there is a thing called FMEA "failure mode effect analysis" which amounts to near enough the same thing, basically, "if this bit fails what will the outcome be"

 

I worry more about the tree breaking than the gear failing..

 

john..

[carlos]

nothing wrong with being the oldest person on the course, the nptc,s are a good basic course in which you would learn loads.

theres plenty of good info on the net but theres no way of knowing whether your implementing it properly.

theres a lot of folk on here who know their stuff, i think you will learn more if you listen to them rather than arguing with them.

carl

[john87]

Yes, but it would be like your grandad turning up for judo lessons!! [i was going to do that last year too!] Unhappily a rather unfortunate medical condition put that on hold, for a bit at least!! Granted i would learn a lot as you say..

 

I should make a video of me climbing and post it for you all to comment on what you like and do not like!!

 

john..