Groundie/climber current rates?

[Retired Climber]

10 minutes ago, Paddy1000111 said:

Sadly, short of making people aware of using Arb approved contractors or some sort of milestone scheme which shows that you have knowledge of the biology of trees etc that will never change. There's a reason why tree surgeons are often seen as a gardener who can climb... 

Haha, nowt wrong with being a gardener who can climb. 😀

[Paddy1000111]

2 minutes ago, Retired Climber said:

Haha, nowt wrong with being a gardener who can climb. 😀

Not at all, but your clients might have questions about the bill... 

[Retired Climber]

21 minutes ago, Paddy1000111 said:

Not at all, but your clients might have questions about the bill... 

If I'm in someone's garden they are paying my minimum hourly rate regardless of what I'm doing. If they want the gardening bits done cheaper, it won't be me who's doing it. 

[Paddy1000111]

31 minutes ago, Retired Climber said:

If I'm in someone's garden they are paying my minimum hourly rate regardless of what I'm doing. If they want the gardening bits done cheaper, it won't be me who's doing it. 

That's not my point, I mean people expect low prices because tree surgeons/arborists aren't looked at in the same way as a plumber/electrician. Whilst the training course isn't as long the initial outlay is a lot more and the costs going forward are a lot more too.

An electrician for example is one of the highest paid building trades yet all you need is basic construction tooling like drills, drivers, chaser, vacuum etc and a decent electrical installation tester and your away, you can easily buy a small van or run it out of a car. When I was doing a little bit of building working for a company as a gap filler between jobs most of prep work was done by us and the sparky put in the cables.

To be a tree surgeon and take on domestic jobs you need multiple saws, climbing kit, rigging kit, a van, a chipper etc. Suddenly moving forward you start looking at skid steers and bigger kit to get the job done. Even if you don't buy and instead rent you won't be competitively priced if you're hiring in a chipper at £150 a day and a skid steer at £180. Aside from training, the actual cost of being a tree surgeon is a lot more than any other trade except maybe groundworks and other big kit companies and the overheads are a lot more unless you are stocking loads of gear in the van as a sparky. 

Given all that, people expect to pay good money for a sparky but want a tree surgeon at almost minimal wage 

Edited February 24, 2021 by Paddy1000111

[Mick Dempsey]

A sparky can burn your house down or kill you years after he’s finished, that’s why they have trade associations and regulations.

 

The worst a tree surgeon can do is prune your tree badly. 
If he damages your property on the day it’s clear and repaired by insurance.

 

I am fairly confident I make more than the majority of sparkys, and have a lot more fun as well.

Edited February 24, 2021 by Mick Dempsey

[Paddy1000111]

19 minutes ago, Mick Dempsey said:

A sparky can burn your house down or kill you years after he’s finished, that’s why they have trade associations and regulations.

 

The worst a tree surgeon can do is prune your tree badly. 
If he damages your property on the day it’s clear and repaired by insurance.

 

I am fairly confident I make more than the majority of sparkys, and have a lot more fun as well.

I completely agree, but a badly done tree inspection or work that creates an unstable tree could quite easily take your house down and pin you under the rubble. There's more than enough videos of people sending 80ft trees through peoples houses on the interwebs and I've been to jobs where an 80+ ft beech has come down in the night and it was only the fact it fell in a good direction that no-one was killed. 

 

I just looked up some statistics and roughly 6 people a year are killed by falling trees/branches in 2017 (the most up to date year I can get info on from ons.gov and not some bs website) says 13 people were killed by exposure to unspecified electrical current (which also includes utilities by the look of it). I wouldn't say that the numbers are far higher for electricity. 

 

All I am saying is prices keep getting driven down by "man with a van" services (usually a unspecified highway maintenance van...) but the price of doing the job keeps going up, kit costs more to buy and maintain, fuel costs more, man hours cost more etc), something has to change eventually or we will just hit a stop. 

Edited February 24, 2021 by Paddy1000111

[AHPP]

ons.gov and not some bs website

That’s the archetype of a bs website. The state is the most egregious incompetent and liar out there.

[Paddy1000111]

Whilst I would agree, its based off what the doctors put on the death cert so unless they have shares in an electrical company or a tree insurance company or something I think they should be relatively reliable 😂

[Mick Dempsey]

29 minutes ago, Paddy1000111 said:

 

 

All I am saying is prices keep getting driven down by "man with a van" services (usually a unspecified highway maintenance van...) but the price of doing the job keeps going up, kit costs more to buy and maintain, fuel costs more, man hours cost more etc), something has to change eventually or we will just hit a stop. 

I’ve been reading the same post on here for years Paddy.

 

We are under appreciated, under paid etc. wah wah wah.

 

You get what you get, if you want appreciation become a nurse or West End star.

 

Nothing will change, work will get done, some people will make money some won’t.

 

Dont worry about the ladder and highway maintenance brigade, if they’re taking your work you’re small potatoes anyway.

[Retired Climber]

1 hour ago, Paddy1000111 said:

That's not my point, I mean people expect low prices because tree surgeons/arborists aren't looked at in the same way as a plumber/electrician. Whilst the training course isn't as long the initial outlay is a lot more and the costs going forward are a lot more too.

An electrician for example is one of the highest paid building trades yet all you need is basic construction tooling like drills, drivers, chaser, vacuum etc and a decent electrical installation tester and your away, you can easily buy a small van or run it out of a car. When I was doing a little bit of building working for a company as a gap filler between jobs most of prep work was done by us and the sparky put in the cables.

To be a tree surgeon and take on domestic jobs you need multiple saws, climbing kit, rigging kit, a van, a chipper etc. Suddenly moving forward you start looking at skid steers and bigger kit to get the job done. Even if you don't buy and instead rent you won't be competitively priced if you're hiring in a chipper at £150 a day and a skid steer at £180. Aside from training, the actual cost of being a tree surgeon is a lot more than any other trade except maybe groundworks and other big kit companies and the overheads are a lot more unless you are stocking loads of gear in the van as a sparky. 

Given all that, people expect to pay good money for a sparky but want a tree surgeon at almost minimal wage 

You need to stop thinking of our services as a commodity; that's just a race to the bottom. Think of yourself as a luxury that people look forward to spending money on and build a business around that assumption.