TPO Justification?

[AA Teccie (Paul)]

I'd (formally) reapply...today!

[Mick Dempsey]

Raining today, so found the tree on Google Earth.

 

 

[Gary Prentice]

1 hour ago, AA Teccie (Paul) said:

Is the original application not still live if they've not determined it, i.e. not issued refusal...which you could then appeal?

I like your thinking Paul 

23 hours ago, benedmonds said:

I have had a recent discussion with a TO who took great umbrage for my justification to first remove and later at their request reduce a tree... They felt that my use of the word hazardous was completely unacceptable and that I should not have used it. Their argument was that the council would only listen to a justification that was inline with their tree policy, 

What a strange interpretation of the regulations. The LA are obliged to determine an application on the information supplied. If the reason for works is that the hue of the foliage clashes with the patio furniture, so be it.  

 

 

 

 

I'm not surprised that the pruning app is regarded as a new app, with a new timeline.

You could have kept the original application in play (open to appeal on refusal) and submitted a pruning spec at the same time. I.e had two applications in play at the same time and allowing the LA to determine both. I've done this myself when I didn't feel that there was any real justification to fell but that was the clients main desire. 

 

Looking at the Defra site, Chalara was first confirmed in that area around 2015/2016 so personally I think any pruning app isn't a great idea. Talking to clients I'm raising the suggestion that ash should be left alone except for pruning works necessary for safety reasons. I don't see any point in doing work now and then the tree gets infected in a few years and being removed. If I was a tree owner I'd be disgruntled paying out twice.

 

I think it's time to be pragmatic about ash as a species, 95% are likely to die so we have a responsibility to make clients aware of this in the tree management process. If the client can afford or wants to work towards short term gains involving pruning it's their decision but they should come to that decision in full knowledge of the facts.

 

I'll get off my soapbox now 

 

 

 

[benedmonds]

19 minutes ago, Gary Prentice said:

I'm not surprised that the pruning app is regarded as a new app, with a new timeline.

You could have kept the original application in play (open to appeal on refusal) and submitted a pruning spec at the same time. I.e had two applications in play at the same time and allowing the LA to determine both. I've done this myself when I didn't feel that there was any real justification to fell but that was the clients main desire. 

I have also in the past made multiple applications for different works to the same tree at the same time, but in this case I didn't, and still don't think the reduction is a good idea.. I only changed it as the LPA said they would not give permission for the fell and we should change it to a reduce.  The client wasn't happy but wanted something done to the tree.

 

They LPA have now rejected the reduce that they recommended we apply for..... and withdrawn my original application to fell... I am not going to appeal the reduce as it was their stupid idea but I would appeal the fell as it is a sensible idea...

[Gary Prentice]

1 minute ago, benedmonds said:

I have also in the past made multiple applications for different works to the same tree at the same time, but in this case I didn't, and still don't think the reduction is a good idea.. I only changed it as the LPA said they would not give permission for the fell and we should change it to a reduce.  The client wasn't happy but wanted something done to the tree.

 

They LPA have now rejected the reduce that they recommended we apply for..... and withdrawn my original application to fell... I am not going to appeal the reduce as it was their stupid idea but I would appeal the fell as it is a sensible idea...

They don't really help themselves sometimes do they?

 

your client's going to have to understand that if you resubmit to fell the procedure is going to involve some lengthy delays. By the time PINs gets involved the tree might be showing symptoms of chalara and everything will be mute anyway.

[difflock]

mute?, moot perhaps

[Jon Heuch]

7 hours ago, benedmonds said:

The council withdrew the initial application to fell when they told me to change the application to a reduce...

The council can't unilaterally "withdraw" an application; it's your application and they can only put it to one side if you have, in writing, agreed to do so. So if 8 weeks have passed and they haven't determined it or have made a statement up to say you have agreed to withdraw it when you haven't you might be able to appeal.....but that's 6-12 months wait for a decision and if you go the fast track you will be dependent on what you put in your original application.....was it good enough for an appeal?

 

But most importantly, what were the given reasons for refusal on the second application? You may want to appeal both applications together so the reasons for the second may need to be addressed.

[benedmonds]

48 minutes ago, Jon Heuch said:

But most importantly, what were the given reasons for refusal on the second application? You may want to appeal both applications together so the reasons for the second may need to be addressed.

The first reason for the refusal of the second application is valid and I would not have made the application to reduce the tree had they not suggested it..... 

 

The proposed works would have a detrimental affect on the appearance of the tree
which makes a significant contribution to the appearance and character of the area.

The local planning authority is not satisfied that there are any reasons for the works that
are sufficient to over-ride the beneficial impact that the tree has on the character of the
area that would otherwise be seriously reduced.

[Stubby]

2 hours ago, difflock said:

mute?, moot perhaps

Or as " Joey " on friends said , " a moo point "   ( a cow might just as well said it "

[benedmonds]

7 minutes ago, EdwardC said:

 

But Jon is bang on. If you are to go back down the felling route you may be better to do another application with better reasons for the work..

But what better reason is there.... It is a healthy tree but in the wrong place. The owner and neighbours want it gone the lpa doesn't. It is down to an opinion and opinions differ..