Pedestrian access and liability.

[Smith126]

Evening all,

 

Today we were working on a tree which was over hanging a road and pathway walking underneath it. 

 

We understand about the traffic control and basically stopped traffic in both directions when nessary, however, my query is pedestrians, 

 

if a pedestrian needs to get from one side of the tree to other, in this instance, there was also a pavement on the other side, do you...

 

a. make the climber aware and pause works, allow them under the tree once the climber has stopped? 

b. Suggest crossing the road unaided, 

c.stop traffic to allow them to cross the road safely. 

 

I can see liability issues with two, a, they could get hit by falling hanger... b. Hit by a car, however c. Strikes me as disrupting the traffic.

 

Where would you stand if HSE turned up on site? 

 

I would be be interested to know your thoughts, and whether anyone has experience where it has gone wrong, or done a course? 

 

Just a matter of interest. Cheers.  

Edited December 21, 2017 by Smith126

[TGB]

Generally speaking, Joe Public are a law unto themselves. It doesn't matter what you do, if a pedestrian, cyclist or motorist wants to get from A-B, even if their chosen route happens to be the most dangerous path, then they will take it regardless of your best intensional.

 

Also, you can't and indeed won't please everyone all the time. Their are always individuals or groups, that having been that way a hundred times before, are more than happy to be belligerent just to thwart your best laid plans.

 

In short - it doesn't matter what you do, some will be happy, even thankful that you are showing care for their wellbeing. While other won't give a damn. And will happily ignore good advice just to be awkward or to take the shortest route or because they've survived thus far of sheer dumb luck or because in their mind, no one shall ever be above their intellect, so, they will go wherever they like when they like and let the world be damned.

 

Children are children. Adolescents are just passing time between being a child and being an adult. Adults and and too often are, thick as two short planks and twice as wooden.

 

[Stubby]

As TGB says . People hate inconvenience .  We have had " footpath closed signs " , cones , plastic red and white barriers and a jogger completely ignored them , vaulted the first barrier  , ran through the kill zone  , and fell flat on his face attempting to vault the other barrier . Is a nightmare !

Edited December 22, 2017 by Stubby

[benedmonds]

Legally you should be have continuous barriers and cones to keep the traffic away from the barriers, and ramps etc... In reality that would involve a huge  amount of TM and is rarely  done...  but if  something when pear-shaped that would be what was expected...

 

Snippet from Traffic Signs Manual Chapter 8.

 

O3.13 PEDESTRIANS
O3.13.1 Road works will often interfere with the free movement of pedestrians causing them to be diverted from their usual path and even on to the carriageway. Pedestrians shall never be forced into dangerous situations. They should be protected from the works and vehicular traffic by means of continuous barriers that clearly delineate and warn pedestrians of the works’ presence; see also paragraph

 

O4.11.6.O3.13.2 Traffic cones must not be used as a barrier system. Pedestrian barrier systems, when placed in the carriageway, must be separated from the adjacent traffic lane by either traffic cones or temporary vehicle safety barriers. It is not acceptable to separate pedestrians and vehicular traffic only with pedestrian barrier.

[Smith126]

Nice one! Cheers guys. 

[OakStag]

Worked on a tree not too long ago, had a member from the local council come out and force us to close the footpath completely rather than monitoring the foootfall.

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

On 21 December 2017 at 23:42, Smith126 said:

I would be be interested to know your thoughts, and whether anyone has experience where it has gone wrong, or done a course? 

There are (at least) 2 possible answers, one is the right answer, the other is at your own discretion:

 

(1) The text book answer - if you haven't 'done the course', passed the exam, got a ticketed operator on site and a supervisor on call having signed off the plan, and applied for and received your LA's version of the permission to work in the highway (and highway margins), and got the mandated PL insurance, and implemented the correct TM according to the road and conditions....  It doesn't make a great deal of difference what you do, you won't be compliant.  Or, perhaps get a TM company to do all of that for you.

 

(2) At your own discretion (and as many have done before and will do in the future) do your best and hope it doesn't go TU.   

 

Anything in between is just kidding yourself.... 

[oldwoodcutter]

Just this last week I had a cycleway/ footpath coned off solid and double hazard taped, below some high pines we were top thinning. Even with a high viz and helmeted guy solely responsible for that small section, some still came through by shoving my cones out of the way and breaking through the tapes.

[Khriss]

On 22/12/2017 at 07:42, Stubby said:

As TGB says . People hate inconvenience .  We have had " footpath closed signs " , cones , plastic red and white barriers and a jogger completely ignored them , vaulted the first barrier  , ran through the kill zone  , and fell flat on his face attempting to vault the other barrier . Is a nightmare !

........and you didnt get it on video , Stubby ...oh shame ! K

 

 

Also - a couple of those plastic ramps fr wheelchairs n push chairs are a must ! Shows a lot of fore-thought .