Chainsaw seizing and Aspen fuel

[Pureevil222]

There is quite the ordeal that has caused me to Bring this here. To get opinions from people who may have had something like this happen or any advice for us. My sister and I aren't mechanically inclined. But my dad is. 

 

My sister and I purchased a chainsaw from Timberland (a Canadian chainsaw and stuff place) for Christmas for my father. After it had been sitting for the winter (my dad had a hernia surgery and wasn't allowed to do anything) and Because of old fuel it needed a new carborator and a clean up which we paid for, they said they put Aspen in the engine. And that they don't carry any straight fuel. They carry both Aspen 2 and 4. 

 

They gave it back to him with a bottle of Aspen 2 and told him to use it and don't mix it. 

 

He's used the 50:1 mix of oil and gas for everything else like old chainsaws and Lawnmower's. He has never used Aspen before. 

 

My father is deaf. But does follow instructions. (I bring this up because he has been screwed over in the past because of him being deaf) 

 

My father is very meticulous so he had that bottle of Aspen 2 placed beside the stahl chainsaw. And when he went to use it, he refilled it with the Aspen 2 from the bottle that was given to him. 

They didn't test it in front of my dad when he got it back to begin with. 

 

The spark plug wasn't attached which was preventing it from starting, 

He noticed this and reattached it, then the engine seized. 

 

He brought it to Timberland and they said that the spark plug wasn't attached again. So the 1 guy replaced that, then it wouldn't start. So they took it in the back. Then they call me and say it seized because of there being 100% pure fuel in there. So there was no warrenty covering wrong fuel. 

 

They poured to show us the fuel in the saw, yes it was clear with a slight yellow tinge. 

So obviously not Aspen 2. If Aspen 2 is yellow. 

 

They poured from a 5l jug of Aspen 2 and it was a deep yellow. 

 

My dad brought me the bottle of Aspen 2 that they gave him, it is a slight yellow, not as deep a yellow as theirs. 

 

Is there another way to tell if the fuel in there maybe Aspen 4 instead of 2? 

 

That would explain if the service person put Aspen 4 in (clear) and my dad put some Aspen 2 in which is a slight yellow. Why it would look almost clear with a yellow tinge?

 

But we seem to be getting screwed over this, they are offering a new saw at cost, but that is still 400$ more than we can all afford right now. 

 

I'm sorry for the rambling, I'm just trying to figure out what could have went wrong. 

 

I don't know how else to prove that my dad didn't put anything besides what he was given (the Aspen 2) into the saw. 

 

So any other outside opinions would be helpful. 

[Khriss]

Hello, hmm Aspen is good quality fuel, not sure if the blame is on the saw or the fuel mix, it does sound like the dealer is taking you for a ride  k

[Stubby]

Hi . From your description it does sound like it has been miss fueled  with Aspen 4 initially by the dealer . How you would prove that is another matter . Good luck !

[Aspen@AAOIL]

sounds like something doesn't add up here.

 

Are you saying that the machine seized instantly, the first time your dad went to use it after they repaired it? before your dad even got to use the chainsaw? and that they didnt show him that it was running when he picked it up?

 

 

[josharb87]

First of all it should not have needed a new carburetor after just one winter idle. 

 

Was it a new saw when you purchased it? 

 

[Pureevil222]

Thank you everyone for your support. 

 

@josharb87 it was a new saw when we purchased it yes, with warrenty, and extended warrenty. 

 

Because of sitting it wouldn't start, so they replaced parts, cleaned it out costed Me 150$ because I paid for it as the awesome daughter I am because it wasn't covered under warrenty. Apparently.

 

turns out the starting issue was spark plug related or at least that's what it seems from the next part I'm writing in this.. as I'm now putting together while writing this.

 

@Aspen@AAOIL I was sitting with both my dad and mom yesterday (both are deaf but not dumb.. this is so frustrating) and asked them the same questions separately if the guy at Timberland tested It in front of them before giving it to them to bring home after they repaired it and fueled it with whichever Aspen was put in. 

 

So before it went in it was really hard to start, but it started, straight from the company, brand spanking new, but it worked. Then it stopped working; repairs happened and they gave it back without testing it in front of my parents. My dad thought it was nice that the one guy gave him a bottle of Aspen 2 to put in it. He had never seen anything like this fuel before. 

 

These repairs happened I think in the middle of winter. So my dad just put it in the garage with the Aspen 2 bottle on a shelf above it, so he wouldn't forget this was for that. His pump petrol, he keeps in a shed separate from his garage. And never brings that to the garage. He brings whatever to the shed to fuel up. (Like I said meticulous about things, and safety, he's almost 70 and has been doing this stuff including mechanics and small engine mechanics since he was a boy) 

 

so then Spring comes around, first time my dad goes to use it, realizes that the tank is half full so fills it up with The bottle of Aspen 2, (which was only a quarter of the bottle) 

 

goes to the place to chop the tree, and tries to start it to no avail. Pulled his shoulder trying to do so. 

Looks it over in the basic places and notices the spark plug wire isn't in the right spot, it's curled up so it's not where it needed to be to catch the fuel or whatever happens... I'm assuming that that causes a spark or something to start it, (my dad didn't really explain that part to me). But anyways that wasn't where it was supposed to be, so he pushed it back down. Brought it back out to the tree and tried again, this time after a few good pulls it started for a few seconds then seized and the chain clipped the frame. My dad got mad and put it away. And puts tape around the Aspen 2 bottle to make sure no one would use it. No one uses his stuff anyway but again he's very particular about where things go, making sure nothing is usable without him knowing and he didn't want accidental usage of something he now thinks is crap even though it might not be.

A month later he tells me about what happened. I tell him to bring it in because it should still be under extended warrenty. 

 

So he does. The man Bob, who gave him the Aspen 2 (my dads favourite guy there) tries to start it, again to no avail. 

He checks the spark plug and it's again in a position where it wouldn't fire. 

 

(This is why I think it was just the stupid spark plug to begin with now and I got screwed out of the repair not under warrenty cost, I don't know these things and I'm getting mad. Seemingly they want to rip off a senior deaf couple and their daughters because they think that they don't understand these things) 

 

Bob then changes the spark plug and secures it. And tries to start it. Still nothing. 

 

So then hen he puts it in the back to repair it. I get a call from the place 2 weeks later and they are saying that because there is straight FUEL in the gas tank it seized. And is too expensive to fix. 

So they want to know what I would like to do. I said well isn't it under warrenty, they said the warrenty was over by 2 months.  I said I swear I bought the extended warrenty. And then he said something along the lines of well even if there was the warrenty it wouldn't cover it, at best we could cover the parts but not the labour. But then it's still fairly expensive to fix. I told him I would talk to my parents about what he said and we could all come in and discuss it. Since my parents live outside of the city we had to go in when they came to the city. Which was another 2  weeks or so later. 

At that meeting the guy showed me the fuel in the tank of the chainsaw (I keep saying fuel right now because that's what he kept saying.) then he kept re-illiterateting that there was supposed to be a 50:1 mix in there, not straight gas. 

 

And my dad knows this, he showed the bottle of what he mixes with pump petrol. And that he knows that. He would never put pure gas into a chainsaw. This was the first time he never mixed anything when fueling up a chainsaw. Because he was doing what Bob told him, to just put the Aspen 2 in there. 

 

They asked if anyone else used the chainsaw he said no, no one but it wouldn't start anyway. 

 

They poured the Aspen 2 from my dads bottle after Un taping it, (because I got him to bring it in with him) compared the colours to the fuel in the saw. The Aspen 2 poured from the bottle was somewhat yellow, had a woodsy smell from what I remember. 

Then the fuel in the chainsaw was way more clear, had a slight yellow tinge (maybe from the Aspen 2 that was poured into there when my dad poured it into the saw? I think that if he didn't pour that in it would have been extremely clear, but who's to say for sure?)

 

and the smell of it if it was slightly different... but didn't smell like gas I thought...I've been around my dad and gas stations throughout my 35 years to recognize gas as soon as I smell it, or so I thought.... I was then questioning if pump petrol smelled like what I was smelling. My dad didn't even want to smell it because it was clear enough to assume it was gas. But my dad said it smelled different. 

And my dad said that he didn't put straight fuel In the tank, only from this bottle of Aspen2, so the guy said that the co-owner Grant, would be back in a week and that he would call me when he got in because it was too big of a thing to decide cuz he is a lowly minion. (My wording) 

 

So low and behold co-owner Grant did not call me. So I told my dad if he didn't call by Monday Him and I would go in and talk to him. Then Monday came around and all of that from my first post happened.. 

 

I understand if someone there made a mistake, just own up to it and fix the issue. 

My dad is the first person to own up if he makes a mistake or anything. He has been losing sleep over this whole thing. Thinking through his steps. Then repeatedly talking me through what happened after it came home from repairs. 

 

I've heard the same thing from him repeatedly every single time I see him which the past 2/3 weeks has been a lot, for appointments I have to interpret for him. And he stays with me probably for a good 4 or more hours before he has to pick up my mom to go home. 

So I'm getting more and more upset, every time he tells me the same thing. 

And I'm putting his story together. 

 

To try and figure out how to prove that my dad knows what he's doing, that he wouldn't lie. This is my dads honour, my honour. That I seem to be fighting for. 

 

I asked my dad to take pictures of his shed where he keeps his petrol fuels, and his Quonset (garage) and where he kept the new saw (the sthl saw that seized) and the Aspen 2, to show just how anal he is about what goes where, and what gets used with what. 

His system is set up for VERY little error. 

Im even thinking of contacting the city's consumer troubleshooter about this. 

 

This is A LOT of effort to put in if it was a lie.. seems like it would be a bit exhausting to keep up, (I'm sure there is some people in this world who would do that, but my family isn't one of them) my parents are fairly simple, my mom works out, knows cooking, baking, and her work. All my dad does is fix things, yard work and renovating their house. All by himself. He doesn't have time to think up an elaborate lie because he has too many projects. 

I don't have the mental energy to fight for things or people I don't believe in. So this is really getting to me. 

 

@everyone on this thread. I do appreciate you guys reading this asking questions and providing your input, especially with my ramblings and talking through this. Seeing if I'm missing anything. 

 

Outside views are important especially when dealing with something so close up. 

So Thank you all, again!! 

 

 

[Stubby]

I am really sorry to hear about all your troubles . One thing I must mention is the pump fuel . I would not use pump fuel that has been mixed up to the right ratio ( 50:1 with modern 2 stroke oils ) if its more than a month old . It starts to degrade the moment you get it from the pump and breaks down the oil that you have added  .  If its more than 4 weeks old I would ditch it and make up some fresh .  Aspen is slightly different as it is refined from the very top of the refinery ( hence the higher price ) BUT it has a shelf life of 5 years un opened and 3 years  if its been opened . I just wonder if the problems were caused by your Dad using old ( more than 4 weeks ) pump fuel mix . Just a thought . I do hope you get it resolved fairly . I wish you and your family all the luck I can muster !

[Aspen@AAOIL]

@Pureevil222

 

wow thats some story and as you say, you have gone into a lot of trouble if it was to cover up a lie.

 

Aspen 2 is the same as Aspen 4 just with added oil so the smell is very similar. As you say, if it was neat "gas" in the tank then you would certainly be able to smell the difference.

 

good luck with your quest to get your machine fixed. from what you have said it doesn't sound like you are in the wrong and if the machine has done as little work as it has then it should be obvious by the condition of the saw.

 

Just for the record, leaving modern fuel (gas) in your machine for a long period of time can cause carburetor issues which arent covered under warranty. Its a shame that the shop didn't sell your father Aspen 2 from day 1! 

[Pureevil222]

@Stubby yes, that is completely understandable which is why the original repair, my dad couldn't empty the tank before using it up because he went for surgery before he could. He pretty much uses all mixed pump fuel (50:1 ration gas and oil) quickly, he has an acreage to take care of between him sawing down trees, (which he has been using a Felling Axe) to cut down his trees before they fall on his house, or the beaver in the area gets at them and wrecks the fence he put up. Lol, They have never seen a beaver in that area until this year. They have been living there for 10 years. Lol Canadian Problems. Haha. Mowing the lawn and hedging the ends, during the summer He goes through a lot of the mix. So there's not usually any sitting around long enough to expire. Except for when he had to get his hernia surgery. That's when the old fuel was. And the original repair after the old fuel. It's good to know that I didn't get ripped off for that repair then. 

 

But after the repair, they just handed it over to my dad and mom without showing it was working.  Gave him the Aspen 2, told him to only use that from now on and sent him on his way. 

 

@Aspen@AAOIL They didn't even tell my sister and I about Aspen 2 when we bought it for him for Christmas. So it really does suck that it wasn't brought up then. Then the original problem may not have happened. 

Unless the spark plug thing was also a factor in it as well being incredibly hard to start to begin with.....?

 

Im tempted to bring in some pump gas, into their shop and do a blind smell test... with them. 

 

Pump, vs Aspen 2 vs, Aspen 4  vs fuel in dads chainsaw. 

 

But then I fear they might say I rigged it. 

Unless I get a reputable person maybe the consumer trouble shooter to do it. 

 

Unless I film filling the gas container at the pump, filming the drive there, without stopping, filming there until we get there, showing the film. 

Buying new containers of Aspen 2 and 4, plus my dads container of Aspen2, getting them to pour them all into clear cups putting a cup that's not clear with what it is, written on the inside so no one can see until the very end. 

 

Mix them up in that whole game sort of way, and put each cup on a piece of paper. That has all 5 written on each piece of paper. And each person plus any that come in can play find the "neat" gas. 

 

All while filming of course because thats gets rid of any he said she said. 

This sounds like the worst game ever. And so much work. 

But if that's what it has to be I will. 

And then I will share it on EVERYTHING! I swear. 

 

Im just that fed up. It's so easy for other people to get things remedied but always an extra hassle for my parents. 

[Stubby]

I godda ask ( maybe you have already said ) but what is the make of the saw . If its a cheap Chinese jobbie then maybe cut your losses , get a pro saw ( Husqvarna , Stihl , Echo or Dolmar ) and start again .