Potus ???

[Richard 1234]

Yep - the consensus is overwhelming. Depending on where you look it's somewhere between 80 and 95% of academics, people who've devoted their lives to studying climate, believe the main contributing factor to temperature raise is human activity, be that through animal agriculture or general pollution.

 

 

 

Trees aren't actually that much of a biggie, there's trillions left. Sure, it doesn't help but, for the most part, their carbon neutral.

 

 

Each can take their own view on this. I personally think humans are insignificant in the earths time line.

I do think we don't help things to an extent and that's all that's been "proved" so far. We do know that the planet has been heating up and cooling down over several billion years(or do we?)

I do think that we should be trying to clean our mess up though!

 

To add to that these academics are only seeing what has been happening in their lifetimes work (and guessing at the past)which in the scheme of things is nothing.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Arbtalk

Edited November 14, 2016 by Richard 1234

[agg221]

I think you over-estimate the potential impacts of both the EU referendum and Presidential election outcomes.

 

Things will not change overnight and any changes that are at all will be gradual, the world order is too large and powerful for anything or anyone to change it massively and/or quickly. And while I think change is required, I can also see that on balance this is probably a good thing.

 

Globalisation will not disappear, the concept of the huge and powerful multi-national company and it's ability to wield power will not disappear, developed western democracies will not become isolationist (your N Korea analogy is a bit OTT is it not?), people will continue to go to other countries to live and work when beneficial to all concerned, etc, etc.

 

However, many of these concepts are reaching levels where they are starting to become problematic (at best) and my hope is that these results are a signal to the establishment that there are limits to what us common people at the bottom of the food chain will tolerate.

 

Surely it's particularly appropriate today, to appreciate that these messages are better conveyed by a democratic vote than by doing nothing and ending up with violence.

 

I don't disagree with your assessment at all. FWIW I was not suggesting that any state is going to become like North Korea, rather that this would be the only way to create a truly ideology-based state because anything else requires interaction on a global level, i.e. it becomes a compromise.

 

I expect that we will have a similar compromise arising here. The only exception is if some idiot in the White House decides it is a good idea to go poking rogue states with a big stick.

 

Brexit will probably have more impact, but as you say this will be gradual rather than overnight.

 

Alec

[DanClimbsTrees]

Each can take their own view on this. I personally think humans are insignificant in the earths time line.

I do think we don't help things to an extent and that's all that's been "proved" so far. We do know that the planet has been heating up and cooling down over several billion years(or do we?)

I do think that we should be trying to clean our mess up though!

 

To add to that these academics are only seeing what has been happening in their lifetimes work (and guessing at the past)which in the scheme of things is nothing.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Arbtalk

 

You're right, anyone is allowed a view, however, with respect, mine and your views are largely irrelevant, unless you're a climate scientist that is. Science doesn't work on opinion.

 

Global temperature has been going up and down for millennia, however, it's the rate of change of temperature that is indisputable. If you check out that (I think NASA has some good resources on their site) you'll see what I mean. Rate of chance of temperature starts to increase dramatically (way way faster than the Earth's natural ups and downs, something completely unprecedented) as soon as humans started pumping mass amounts of CO2 and other greenhouse gases into the atmosphere. The chances of this being a coincidence are basically nought.

[jomoco]

Lumps of coal all round the world, eh lads?

[wrsni]

Yep - the consensus is overwhelming. Depending on where you look it's somewhere between 80 and 95% of academics, people who've devoted their lives to studying climate, believe the main contributing factor to temperature raise is human activity, be that through animal agriculture or general pollution.

 

Trees aren't actually that much of a biggie, there's trillions left. Sure, it doesn't help but, for the most part, their carbon neutral.

 

Was there not a big hullaballoo a year or two ago when some government funded climate change research group was found to have been fiddling the data to back up their papers?

 

Doesn't say much for the argument when that happens!

 

Nor is the consensus "overwhelming", there are as many well qualified people making well supported arguments against climate change being driven by human activity as there are for it.

 

Depends what you want to see!

[difflock]

Yep - the consensus is overwhelming. Depending ohere you look it's somewhere between 80 and 95% of academics, people who've devoted their lives to studying climate, believe the main contributing factor to temperature raise is human activity,n w be that through animal agriculture or general pollution.

 

Trees aren't actually that much of a biggie, there's trillions left. Sure, it doesn't help but, for the most part, their carbon neutral.

 

:001_rolleyes:people who've devoted their lives to studying climate:001_rolleyes:

 

says it all, dosnt it:001_rolleyes:

 

i.e. making a living from climate change grants and funding, in effect a classic "feed-back" phenomena.

 

P.S.

Never mind the opening "depending on where you look":001_rolleyes:

Edited November 14, 2016 by difflock

[Haironyourchest]

Climate change - the great religion of our time. The climate scientists have become the priests, the "data" has become their doctrine, and our CO2 output is our "sin" that will bring the wrath of God (nature) down on our heads. The renniceance is here now, the ranks of the delusion-makers have been broken by the heretics, Trump et al. 30,000 scientists, 10,000 of which hold phds, have signed a statement that ACC is a hoax. How's that for "consensus"? But like any religion, there will still be faithful believers long after history has proven it a load of tosh. Such is human nature, lord bless 'em.

[Vespasian]

Climate change - the great religion of our time. The climate scientists have become the priests, the "data" has become their doctrine, and our CO2 output is our "sin" that will bring the wrath of God (nature) down on our heads. The renniceance is here now, the ranks of the delusion-makers have been broken by the heretics, Trump et al. 30,000 scientists, 10,000 of which hold phds, have signed a statement that ACC is a hoax. How's that for "consensus"? But like any religion, there will still be faithful believers long after history has proven it a load of tosh. Such is human nature, lord bless 'em.

 

Not such a bad way of puttin it... not far off the mark, more so than you might imagine as well...

 

My take on the subject is that Climate change is not whats behind it, human or inviroment, but what its being used for...

To promote a changeover from fossil fuels to alternative forms of energy...

 

And that only to forestall a greater danger than climate change itself...

 

In the not to distant future, oil is gonna get harder to come by, it can't last for ever... we know what we have, we know how long it might last, but we don't know whats gonna take its place....

 

Thats the conundrum thats driving the promotion of alternative energy... an attempt to conserve, to buy time to work on its replacement.....

 

Oh I might add that thirty thousand scientists don't add up to nothin when those so called scientists aren't working in the field....

[matelot]

Unless the East European "Big Issue" sellers are claiming benefits, quite frankly, I have no problem with them being here selling the "Big Issue".

 

Tbh, I thought it was widely known that East European "Big Issue" sellers claim benefits.... They sell it so they are classified as self employed.... So the country is financially struggling yet we give money to Romanian Big Issue sellers?

 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/media/greenslade/2014/jun/05/the-big-issue-iain-duncan-smith

 

 

Millions of migrants would bring issues but we don't have millions, we have hundreds of thousands from the EU.

 

There are 8 million foreigners living in the UK. So I'm glad we can both agree that mass migration brings "issues"....

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign-born_population_of_the_United_Kingdom

 

 

Tbh, it's time we stopped mass migration to the UK and started deporting migrants that quite frankly want to kill us.

[agg221]

Tbh, it's time we stopped mass migration to the UK and started deporting migrants that quite frankly want to kill us.

 

Hmmm. See previous point on mass hysteria.

 

Alec

 

P.s. Did Freddie Starr eat your hamster?