College and what the industry really needs

[MattyF]

Agree kev that's why I say they should have a minimum of 6 months already in the industry so they know what they are letting them selfs in for and not wasting very ones time they come across in the future, there own included.

[Mat]

Please state

the work you do and

what exactly you'd like your new apprentices to be able to do and

what you think they should know.

 

Work: Health and Safety Professional

 

Abilities of new starters in the forest or arb industry: New starters in the workplace should be expected to practically nothing

 

Knowledge of new starters: New starters in the workplace should be expected to know nothing Forest or arb related.

 

I know that there is a lot of 'science' in the industry with plenty of work for technically minded individuals BUT....

 

Foresty and arb consists predominately of manual labour.

 

Most 'manual' industry sectors operate perfectly well with on the job training, which is the only way to get experience and build competence in the workplace.

 

There are historical reasons why the forestry and arb industry believes that there must be a way of turning out collage leavers that will be as good as existing experienced and competent workers, but it is a false expectation that is unlikely ever to be released.

[MWArb]

Does that mean we can't strive for it? at least producing a competent learner able to do the list dan describes earlier in thread

[penfold]

When I did my NC at Houghall, we had block practical sessions of a week or two weeks and then in between we had theory and the odd practical session.

[easy-lift guy]

What I had in mind is probably a bit extreme (but not really.)

 

Course week 1 designed to emulate the worst possible working week.

 

Cold, tired, wet, hungry, broken kit, changed priorities, problem solving under pressure etc etc....

 

The individual that can remain focussed on the task and press on even though the body is ready to collapse has demonstrated the minerals that will serve them well in the industry - and life.

 

Easily delivered through fairly standard and well established 'outward bound' activities (not sure if that's still a recognised phrase?)

 

Also not at all sure it would be in the interest of the college because many will try but few will succeed. It'll effect course subscription and funding.

 

Culling the herd comes to mind. Your on the right track Sir.

easy-lift guy

[Mat]

Does that mean we can't strive for it? at least producing a competent learner able to do the list dan describes earlier in thread

 

Hi Martyn, sorry if I came across flippant.

 

My point was the unrealistic expectation employers seem to have when they believe that a collage leaver will be just the same as current and seasoned members of staff.

 

This forum in general is full of the dashed expectations of employers.

 

The reason I underlined the 'expected' bits is because that expectation should not be there.

 

If you get a new starter that knows stuff and can do stuff, that should be looked as a bonus (along with good aptitude, attitude and the ability to wear a watch and not carry a phone)

[silky fox]

I made college work for me (Houghal)...I emersed myself in my N.C Arb and especially the practicals and asked questions at every opportunity..I made sure I was ready by the time the course ended because in knew it was what I was born to do! It wasn't easy as the course leader was uninterested in us but I honed in on the good lecturers like the great Dave Bentley and went to him if I needed a specific answer.You have to instil confidence and most of all enthusiasm in students first in order for their minds to open like a sponge and absorb what they are taught. I was hungry to learn from day 1.

[MWArb]

Hi Martyn, sorry if I came across flippant.

 

My point was the unrealistic expectation employers seem to have when they believe that a collage leaver will be just the same as current and seasoned member of staff.

 

This forum in general is full of the dashed expectations of employers.

 

The reason I underlined the 'expected' bits is because that expectation should not be there.

 

If you get a new starter that knows stuff and can do stuff, that should be looked as a bonus (along with good aptitude, attitude and the ability to wear a watch and not carry a phone)

 

Your exactly right.. the issue is within the industry aswell.. what I'm proposing is a need for both educational reform but also the resources to send students out without the useless and slow tag either scaring them off the work or worse changing their chosen vocation which without ridicule they may well have blossomed in.. obviously you can't train incompetence out of some, but that's all subjects

[Mat]

I made college work for me (Houghal)...I emersed myself in my N.C Arb and especially the practicals and asked questions at every opportunity..I made sure I was ready by the time the course ended because in knew it was what I was born to do! It wasn't easy as the course leader was uninterested in us but I honed in on the good lecturers like the great Dave Bentley and went to him if I needed a specific answer.You have to instil confidence and most of all enthusiasm in students first in order for their minds to open like a sponge and absorb what they are taught. I was hungry to learn from day 1.

 

That would make you a 'Bonus' then.

 

How are you finding Dartmoor? I 'wasted' my education bunking off school and messing about on the moors around Okehampton.... bloody glad I did - happy days!

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

Ah Mat good evening! Is it a chicken and egg situation though? They aren't really allowed to do anything, or in some cases even be on site without a raft of tickets. So they have to have a ticket just to be there? They need the college to get the ticket, they then need a capable and willing employer with the capacity to supervise and train.

 

(note to self - I am seriously considering taking an apprentice right now, if it all goes TU I may well be back in a month or so to contradict myself!)