Amount of Dead Ash

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

I'm amazed at all the chalara "experts" who are suddenly popping up.

Just because they are late/ have some leaf die-back/ look a bit sick, doesn't mean its chalara.

Yes we will lose most of our Ash trees, yes it's tragic, but to be honest I would be very surprised if most of the country has mature Ash trees displaying diagnostic signs of it yet.

I live in Norfolk and outside of coppiced and sapling trees, it's very hard to spot signs of it yet. some trees, but not most.

This is all getting a bit like the Salem Witch hunt.

Just take a deep breath and calm down

 

Well I am actually pleased to hear so many people concerned about our ash.

 

I personally wouldn't be accusing anyone of being one of your "experts" and discouraging the expression and discussion of something that is going to have a potentially catastrophic effect on A) the ecology B) the firewood industry (after short term gain) C) a massive amount of locked up Carbon now rapidly on its way to a gaseous form once more and D) the aesthetic impact of one of our most iconic trees vanishing from the landscape, as did the Elms.

 

I saw a superb comment earlier today on another issue talking about the "Baseline syndrome" Shifting Baseline Syndrome |

 

Am I one of the so called "Experts" your refering to?

[18 stoner]

I'm amazed at all the chalara "experts" who are suddenly popping up.

Just because they are late/ have some leaf die-back/ look a bit sick, doesn't mean its chalara.

Yes we will lose most of our Ash trees, yes it's tragic, but to be honest I would be very surprised if most of the country has mature Ash trees displaying diagnostic signs of it yet.

I live in Norfolk and outside of coppiced and sapling trees, it's very hard to spot signs of it yet. some trees, but not most.

This is all getting a bit like the Salem Witch hunt.

Just take a deep breath and calm down

 

 

Quite a bizarre statement. You admit we are likely to lose most of our ash, yet still say folk are on a witch hunt?😜

 

Ok, you live in Norfolk. Your back yard isn't a signature for the whole country. It's a bit like having a storm force warning for the whole country and saying "well the roof hasn't blown off my house yet"

[Stubby]

Well I live in a relatively unaffected area ( West Sussex ) and I am no expert but I would be getting twitchy if I lived in the South East . Check out the map ....

[Bren.]

Sorry, my point was that I suspect that many people are seeing symptoms where none exist.

3 or 4 years ago, if you saw dying leaves on an Ash tree, you would not immediately be thinking Chalara. Now it seems that any sign of ill health is put down to it without thought for any of the other possible causes.

 

Ash Bud Moth, for example could be a cause of sickly looking trees, or it could be simple Ash decline caused by poor soil conditions round the roots ( compaction, ploughing etc). Nope, gotta be chalara!

 

Whats annoying me is that the conversation seems to have stopped when it comes to the Ash. We are all too ready to consign it to the history books.

 

And talk of cutting down infected individuals really pees me off, where are our resistant trees going to come from if we don't give them a chance to show that they are indeed, resistant.

[Tilio-acerion]

From my understanding (Continental experience) there are no Ash trees 'resistant' to Chalara, as they will all become infected and show some symptoms of dieback. There will be differing levels of tolerance, some individuals having almost none and some having very high levels but this is different to being resistant.

 

In comparison to Elm, say where there is a healthy mature specimen growing in an area where DED is active, there is a good Beetle population and it is adjacent to dead and dying infected Elms - all which have been the case for a lengthy period - would strongly suggest that it is resistant, as there is no way that Beetles will not have fed on it.

[skyhuck]

I thought Chalara was relatively difficult to confirm, however its now apparently easy to spot from a speeding train???

 

As for trees having dead leaves 3 weeks ago, very few if any Ash even had leaves 3 weeks ago, were these last years dead leaves????

[Stubby]

I thought Chalara was relatively difficult to confirm, however its now apparently easy to spot from a speeding train???

 

As for trees having dead leaves 3 weeks ago, very few if any Ash even had leaves 3 weeks ago, were these last years dead leaves????

 

I think what has been spotted from the speeding train is the brown looking keys yet to drop ....

[Gardenmac]

I think what has been spotted from the speeding train is the brown looking keys yet to drop ....

 

35 years of site management means I know the difference between an Ash key and a shrivelled distressed Ash Leaf!!! There are a lot of trees that are completely dead, even back three weeks ago it was clear trees where in trouble and yes that was from a speeding train. Mainly because the train slowed down many times on the journey and was close enough to trees along the track side to see branches dying back from the tips with wilted leaves not keys.

But then again maybe you know better as I don't claim to be an expert and you clearly seem to be.

[Stubby]

35 years of site management means I know the difference between an Ash key and a shrivelled distressed Ash Leaf!!! There are a lot of trees that are completely dead, even back three weeks ago it was clear trees where in trouble and yes that was from a speeding train. Mainly because the train slowed down many times on the journey and was close enough to trees along the track side to see branches dying back from the tips with wilted leaves not keys.

But then again maybe you know better as I don't claim to be an expert and you clearly seem to be.

 

No . I'm no expert . Just offering an alternative from the view point of Hucks post . I accept you know what you have seen . After all I was not there . Sorry mate .

[18 stoner]

Mmmm, and just to add a little more gravy salts to the water, depending when twigs die, they may retain keys. A healthy tree will shed them.