Show us your Arb Diggers please.

[openspaceman]

2 hours ago, LGP Eddie said:

John Craig and his team have been busy in the workshop at A&B Services (Scotland).

Doosan DX300 Skyline setup, it looks built like a tank!

Someone getting a nice setup there, no I didn’t ask the price!

 

 

 

 

 

Eddie.

Lovely, I hope someone posts a video of it working.

 

Do those wheel motor winches freewheel or must they always be driven in order to release the internal brake?

[LGP Eddie]

8 hours ago, openspaceman said:

Lovely, I hope someone posts a video of it working.

 

Do those wheel motor winches freewheel or must they always be driven in order to release the internal brake?

That’s a good question, I’ve never been in one to even think about how it’s controlled, or things like can you just release the brake and have them freewheel.

I’ll see what I can find out.

 

I’ve never seen a setup in action either, would be great to witness a good team in full flow.

 

 

Eddie.

[ESS]

10 hours ago, openspaceman said:

Lovely, I hope someone posts a video of it working.

 

Do those wheel motor winches freewheel or must they always be driven in order to release the internal brake?

Certainly the ones I have been involved with have free spool on the haul back line.

[openspaceman]

4 minutes ago, ESS said:

Certainly the ones I have been involved with have free spool on the haul back line.

When the control handles got sloppy on my igland 3002 about 15 years ago I thought I'd replace the gearbox with two 3 tonne wheel motors and a pump  as it was similar money to a replacement Igland. What put me off was the wheel motors I looked at all had brakes internally which were controlled by hydraulic pressure to the axial piston motor. I could get two speeds but to freewheel would have involved a manually operated dog clutch.

 

Radial piston motors could be set to freewheel but would have required a separate brake.

 

I'd now still go down the axial wheel motor route and use a simple remote control.

 

An advantage on a small tractor would be the motors could be moved closer to the axle and lower, aiding stability and weight distribution.

[ESS]

9 minutes ago, openspaceman said:

When the control handles got sloppy on my igland 3002 about 15 years ago I thought I'd replace the gearbox with two 3 tonne wheel motors and a pump  as it was similar money to a replacement Igland. What put me off was the wheel motors I looked at all had brakes internally which were controlled by hydraulic pressure to the axial piston motor. I could get two speeds but to freewheel would have involved a manually operated dog clutch.

 

Radial piston motors could be set to freewheel but would have required a separate brake.

 

I'd now still go down the axial wheel motor route and use a simple remote control.

 

An advantage on a small tractor would be the motors could be moved closer to the axle and lower, aiding stability and weight distribution.

I have used a 360 high lead setup that used igland 8000 with oversize drums with an hydraulic motor driving the winch shaft. The clutches are hydraulically operated on those as you probably know, and the brake engages instantly , once the clutch is disengaged. It was very poor on haul power though with the oversize drums. I have had a couple of 8000 mounted winches that would pull houses down, the high lead was very poor in comparison.Igland used to use an accumulator to get charge for the clutch rams to avoid drag on free spool.

[LGP Eddie]

Just passing this on from John himself via a few texts this morning, but I’m intrigued myself now, so will find out more.

 

No this setup doesn’t freespool, and exactly as was just said, you can with an Igland setup but basically no power in them for this application.

 

Controls are on the main Excavator Joysticks handles, with diverter valves to change over the functions.

I assume the main levers are used for maximum Operator comfort and feel.

 

What would normally be the Excavator Boom function operates the Haul in/out.

Dipper function operates the Haul Back in/out.

The Bucket function operates the Skyline.

 

I asked the obvious question about the drums fighting against each other, apparently the control function for this sits between the seat and the levers!

 

Yes I do want a go now!?

 

 

Eddie.

 

[openspaceman]

32 minutes ago, ESS said:

I have used a 360 high lead setup that used igland 8000 with oversize drums with an hydraulic motor driving the winch shaft. The clutches are hydraulically operated on those as you probably know, and the brake engages instantly , once the clutch is disengaged.

Yes I used one on a County 944 but it got to be a problem when the hydraulics got worn. Also it was far too  forceful for the County in the absence of spades, I found the 40002 better matched to the tractor and for a stronger pull found the Farmi 8 tonne on the 1164 better. They both put far too much weight behind the back axle.

32 minutes ago, ESS said:

 

 

It was very poor on haul power though with the oversize drums.

I can appreciate that as when the rope builds up on the drum the force decreased for the same amount of input torque.

 

I always thought twin capstans were the way to go but nobody seems to use them for skylines. An advantage would be that with a differential drive between the twin capstans a constant tension could be maintained in the lines.

 

When you say high lead do you mean the carriage rode on the return line? I did this but found I was burning a lot of power in the return line brake to keep the carriage in the air (mine was a simple pulley carriage with the haul in line passing over a second pulley.

 

Now I have time on my hands I'd like to rig a simple skyline in a small hillside woodland I do voluntary work but the charity that runs it are not keen in funding the machinery movement.

[openspaceman]

33 minutes ago, LGP Eddie said:

I asked the obvious question about the drums fighting against each other, apparently the control function for this sits between the seat and the levers!

Yes this is a problem I was thinking about, it could be overcome by a means of diverting flow by a pressure operated valve between the two flows or more simple, but power wasting, simply dumping pressure from the drum being overrun.

 

There would still be the problem of the internal brake  operating if the pressure in the feed to the drum dropped.

Edited May 9, 2019 by openspaceman

[ESS]

6 minutes ago, openspaceman said:

 

 

When you say high lead do you mean the carriage rode on the return line? I did this but found I was burning a lot of power in the return line brake to keep the carriage in the air (mine was a simple pulley carriage with the haul in line passing over a second pulley.

 

Highlead ,.... without a carriage , basically a 360 with a 2 drum setup , with extended boom to get lift. You just have a haul out /in round a block on the boundary of the stand.

I tested the double drum for Boughton, very solidly built as you can imagine, that bugger could pull.

 

[LGP Eddie]

11 minutes ago, openspaceman said:

Yes this is a problem I was thinking about, it could be overcome by a means of diverting flow by a pressure operated valve between the two flows or more simple, but power wasting, simply dumping pressure from the drum being overrun.

 

There would still be the problem of the internal brake  operating if the pressure in the feed to the drum dropped.

I’m actually going to say there could be a lot more to it than meets the eye knowing John and he perhaps keeps the actual tweaks made well guarded.

They certainly build some fair setups, so whatever the formula it works.

 

 

Eddie.