tendering for local authority work..third party.

[Burytreeman]

This may be a cynical and opinionated responce but from the perspective of the "security Company" who have given you many leads and quotes to do, i would wonder what i ( sec co) had done wrong. I provide you with jobs to tender for, process the paperwork and make sure you get paid. As a business organisation i add my profit margin to the jobs. I am guessing you havent taken the issue up with your "Bosses" over not winning quotes? Working with councils and Local authoraties is an art in itself policies procedures and current political trends can all have an impact on what you do or what work you get.

From my perspective you have a woirking relationship with a company who have provided you with what may be a steady stream of work. Does that in itself not entitle them to some degree of Loyalty or am i speaking fromm a bygone age?

Its interesting how you attribute the instances when you have quoted and not got work to their added margin. Could it be you were possibly high in the first instance?

Like many of the people on here i make a living working for various customers private commercial and local authority. I have a couple of organisations that get me to sub contract in the same way you have. Yes they do put a mark up on and yes it does crank the cost of the job up, however if you want that job then its up to you to absorb what you can to win it taking account of addages!

On occasion i have been asked to work directly but have felt a degree of commitment to those that gave you the work. I wonder how you would feel if some of your staff decided to offer to work for your clients directly to save them money?(and of course make more money themselves)

Within this thread, and arb community, there are many varied perspectives and views.Its what makes it such a good sounding block for support.

Yes you can choose to progress but at what expence? I myself am appreciative of the opportunaties offered by my contacts to tender for work. Its my belief when doing that i owe them thanks and gratitude for helping me.

I may be out of touch , but from a pure cold hard business perspective you only see things in a cold hard way!

I think you owe that security company a debt of gratitude. Thanks to them you have worked and began to establish the links that have allowed you to get your foot in the door, undertake work and get paid.

Yes you can Go direct, abandon the contacts you have, and discover exactly what the security company did actually do for you.

In striving to work directly you could come across as wanting to save the local authiority money. You could also come across as Greedy,totally self interested and ungratefull.

Currently work is tight and becoming more scarce. I for one would welcome the position you find yourself in, as i suspect would many others.

As i mentioned earlier it may be i am from a long past generation, who also value engage and appreciate peoples efforts. You don't mention in your posts if the security company offered the work to other arb contractors or exclusively yourself? If the latter is the case in my opinion you are clearly displaying and abhorent betrayel of trust. Its not a road i myself would choose to travel. I would be happy and appreciative of the work i have beed given. maybe i am wrong but i think Not!

Tony Wilkinson, aka Burytreeman

[Jonny69]

There are several owners of established businesses on this thread that are saying the same thing. I agree with them.

 

It would be foolish to change what is going on now. I don't think you realise how easy you currently have it subcontracting.

 

I subcontract to several different large businesses and councils. This is the best way. I get none of the aggravation of dealing with the client. Just turn up, cut stuff down, go home and get the bill in.

 

There is no point worrying what this business is putting on the jobs. In fact it sounds like they are very sensible by ensuring they employ a professional to carry out the work.

 

Cheers

[Czlowiek Drzewo]

Listen i do agree with some of the stuff you are all saying...and it sure is easier sub contracting!..but being a sub contractor will not really help your business grow that much. When it comes to loyalty..it think the other business would drop me and choose the next cheapest sub contractor if they had the chance..and its strictly business so if a opportunity comes my way i will take it as i am sure many others on here would also. You ned to undersrand that i spend 30% of week driving around quoting these jobs and winning less than 50%. now ..thats bad business in its self and i am not making much from the jobs i win...so the best business decision for me is to still quote the work but try to do it so i can win more of the jobs and the only option i see is quoting directly so local authority. What i a was looking or in this thread is tips on whats the best way to go around this rather than if it is or is not Morally correct to tender direct and quote against the company thats supplies me these jobs. The be honest i could not care about the other company that passes me work as they are making money for nothing from me. Biting the hand that feeds? morrally incorrect? ..it does not matter as its business...and every other business i know is out there trying to make a buck for nothing...i am just trying to offer my skills directly to local authority for the correct rate that i origianlly quote for. Simples.

[Czlowiek Drzewo]

This may be a cynical and opinionated responce but from the perspective of the "security Company" who have given you many leads and quotes to do, i would wonder what i ( sec co) had done wrong. I provide you with jobs to tender for, process the paperwork and make sure you get paid. As a business organisation i add my profit margin to the jobs. I am guessing you havent taken the issue up with your "Bosses" over not winning quotes? Working with councils and Local authoraties is an art in itself policies procedures and current political trends can all have an impact on what you do or what work you get.

From my perspective you have a woirking relationship with a company who have provided you with what may be a steady stream of work. Does that in itself not entitle them to some degree of Loyalty or am i speaking fromm a bygone age?

Its interesting how you attribute the instances when you have quoted and not got work to their added margin. Could it be you were possibly high in the first instance?

Like many of the people on here i make a living working for various customers private commercial and local authority. I have a couple of organisations that get me to sub contract in the same way you have. Yes they do put a mark up on and yes it does crank the cost of the job up, however if you want that job then its up to you to absorb what you can to win it taking account of addages!

On occasion i have been asked to work directly but have felt a degree of commitment to those that gave you the work. I wonder how you would feel if some of your staff decided to offer to work for your clients directly to save them money?(and of course make more money themselves)

Within this thread, and arb community, there are many varied perspectives and views.Its what makes it such a good sounding block for support.

Yes you can choose to progress but at what expence? I myself am appreciative of the opportunaties offered by my contacts to tender for work. Its my belief when doing that i owe them thanks and gratitude for helping me.

I may be out of touch , but from a pure cold hard business perspective you only see things in a cold hard way!

I think you owe that security company a debt of gratitude. Thanks to them you have worked and began to establish the links that have allowed you to get your foot in the door, undertake work and get paid.

Yes you can Go direct, abandon the contacts you have, and discover exactly what the security company did actually do for you.

In striving to work directly you could come across as wanting to save the local authiority money. You could also come across as Greedy,totally self interested and ungratefull.

Currently work is tight and becoming more scarce. I for one would welcome the position you find yourself in, as i suspect would many others.

As i mentioned earlier it may be i am from a long past generation, who also value engage and appreciate peoples efforts. You don't mention in your posts if the security company offered the work to other arb contractors or exclusively yourself? If the latter is the case in my opinion you are clearly displaying and abhorent betrayel of trust. Its not a road i myself would choose to travel. I would be happy and appreciative of the work i have beed given. maybe i am wrong but i think Not!

Tony Wilkinson, aka Burytreeman

 

Tony, you writing this like someone has done this too you before? You do not have all relevent information from my situation to post such an offensive post.

 

Betrayal of trust etc etc, Like i have stated many times they are getting the better deal and should be apprecaitte me more than the other way around. I have all the relevent insurances, staff, equipment etc etc to undertake these jobs for them at a very good rate - plus i am quoting all the work.

 

If this compnay done all the quoting and just asked me to do work based on a day rate i would be more than happy to do this and would not bother chasing same tenders...BUT!...I am doing all the quoting for them at cheap rates to win the work so i don't spend 2 days a week driving around all day quoting foe nothing..and they are putting large percentages on top and losing much of the work because of this...what do they lose? nothing!..but i lose 20% of my working week driving and quoting to gain nothing.

 

I would say that it is not me that is greedy..but this company. them its stricly business..so who cares how many jobs I win as long as they can make money for nothing on some of the jobs. I am not trying to save the local authority money...I am trying to win more work for my business

 

Good business decision for them is to use sub-contractors and good business decision for my self to tender direct.

 

The only thing i owe this company is thanks for opening my eyes up and giving me that extra bit of motivation to grow my business so i can tender direct and make a better living.

 

I can understand that maybe Business is not to great for you Tony and risks like this this may seem silly to you..but in my case business is good and growing at a steady rate so it makes perfect business sense to tender direct.

 

Thanks for you well informed post.

Edited July 13, 2012 by Czlowiek Drzewo

[Czlowiek Drzewo]

There are several owners of established businesses on this thread that are saying the same thing. I agree with them.

 

It would be foolish to change what is going on now. I don't think you realise how easy you currently have it subcontracting.

 

I subcontract to several different large businesses and councils. This is the best way. I get none of the aggravation of dealing with the client. Just turn up, cut stuff down, go home and get the bill in.

 

There is no point worrying what this business is putting on the jobs. In fact it sounds like they are very sensible by ensuring they employ a professional to carry out the work.

 

Cheers

 

Do you quote all the work you subcontracting for?

[skyhuck]

Earlier it was 4 days per month quoting, now it's 8. You make your current situation sound appalling, I can't understand why you've put up with it at all?? And why you need a thread to change this disastrous situation??

[Czlowiek Drzewo]

Earlier it was 4 days per month quoting, now it's 8. You make your current situation sound appalling, I can't understand why you've put up with it at all?? And why you need a thread to change this disastrous situation??

 

I lose 50% of work quoted for due to this which is about 4 days every month driving around quoting wasted )

 

50% of 8 is 4. I win approx that amount. Its not a bad situation just looking for tips on tendering and what others would do in my situation...response is that 80% would just stick to subbing.

[likeitorlumpit]

I'm wondering whether any of our work is like yours.

Have to say we do do a small amount of work quoting for another company although we get every job we quote.

The rest is management companies/housing associations or just private firms who use us direct and the few private jobs we still do.

I don't know what I'd do if I was quoting for 8 days a month for one middleman.

I suspect I'd be thinking - wow thats 50-60 jobs I've quoted for and I've got 25-30 of them so theres plenty there to make money.

I may be thinking ' well I could have another 25-30 jobs but at what risk- lose them all.

Now this security company- lets look at them- Question= do they work for many companies= industrial estates and does this bring in more tree work and of this- do you get any?

See my point- it's not that clear cut-upsetting people in business can be costly. If you win the tender from the council then they (the security co.) will know.

Yes I know- firms out there- especially small firms- often try to poach work from others but by doing this they risk losing their original contact and it's contacts that in the long run really help you succeed.

I run a successful business employing 4 full time and 3 part time staff so I'll let you judge whether I am 'doing it right'

On the other hand you may be right and if I'd followed your approach then I could be boss of a much larger company.

Only the future has the answer and like I said' good luck' for in life you reap what you sow. You must let us know how this pans out. I am genuinely interested even if it means my approach is flawed.

[Tom D]

I loose a lot of work that I quote for, if I didn't I would know that I was too cheap.

 

If you win every job you are undercharging.

 

I also loose a lot of jobs where I am subcontracting and the main contractors margin has pushed the price too high. BUT I would not have been quoting for that job anyway so whats the problem?

[Pedroski]

I lose 50% of work quoted for due to this which is about 4 days every month driving around quoting wasted )

 

50% of 8 is 4. I win approx that amount. Its not a bad situation just looking for tips on tendering and what others would do in my situation...response is that 80% would just stick to subbing.

 

'ere, i've had a thought.... have you tried speaking to the company you are working for? What margin are they putting on? Is their margin REALLY the reason why they're not winning tenders? Or is it that the jobs they're tendering for already have someone lined up to do them?