Domestic use training

[Paul Barton]

Sounds like a business opportunity for someone...there's a potential gap in the market here.

 

...now I have actually followed Paul's LANTRA link...perhaps not.

Edited May 17, 2011 by Paul Barton

[AHPP]

Sounds like a business opportunity for someone...there's a potential gap in the market here.

 

It'd be lovely but I can't see it coming off. As a country we're a bureaucratic bunch and it wouldn't be long before someone wanted a certificate of attendance. Then it wouldn't be long before some certificates of attendance became perceived as more valuable than others. At some point there'd be an argument over who knew best about something and before you know it there's a hierarchy.

Perhaps someone tried to use a certificate of attendance to buy a new top handle saw from a dealer who would normally want to see an NPTC unit or two. More arguments, more ego, more officialdom.

You could just as quickly end up with another line of certificates or a governing body struggle.

 

Either the above or just nobody would be interested because it doesn't seem like as good value if you don't get a ticket from it.

 

 

The people making the money on assessments do so because it is perceived that "you need your tickets" and they can charge what they want if people "need" what they have.

 

 

 

I'd love to see more high quality, no vested interest, no need to be there, doing it purely because you want to (with no assessment or whatever to cloud the mind) training in loads of circles but it's not how the common bureaucracy craving British mind functions at the moment.

I'm hoping there will be a general wise up in the area of "qualification" as it becomes obvious how useless 90% of post millenium graduates are.

[log dog]

hi mark i am probably not far from you if you like i can go over things best i can if you fancy get in touch and we can sort something out meant to offer yesterday oops:001_smile:

[agg221]

I was in a similar position, except that my first saw was an 064 with options of a 2ft bar, or a 3ft Alaskan. This pre-dates CS30/31, but nonetheless some training of some sort might have been/be useful! The point being, it's not just about cutting up the odd bit of firewood, sometimes if you have access to woodland you are inevitably felling, and that doesn't conveniently stop at 'small trees'.

 

In fact, the first thing I felled was 4ft6in oak, standing dead in a field. Perfectly sound timber and textbook cuts (really) and it still fell at right-angles to where I wanted it after snapping the perfect hinge clean off!

 

I suppose things were more relaxed then, and I was lucky with the people I spoke to who were happy to show me how to go about what I was trying to do. I was having timber milled with a portable band mill at the time, and the owner showed me how to fell etc. Another person (tree surgeon) showed me how to limb up on a different tree, and the knowledge built up.

 

The advantage amateurs have is that they're not being paid to do a job quickly. I'm always mindful that the tools I'm working with have a lot of power, and the potential to kill me. I can take the time to assess how to deal with a particular tree, and if I don't like the look of it I can leave it alone.

 

Even now, probably 15yrs on, I would still be interested in some training - not because I need it to be allowed to do what I do, but because it would be good to see what bad habits I have inadvertantly picked up, and fill in any gaps in the information I've gleaned. It's possible that I am sufficiently uncommon for nobody to be interested in running courses along those lines, but maybe with the rise in firewood prices, the availability of saws of any size to anybody on ebay for a few hundred and the relatively easy access to Alaskan mills (and the pleasure of milling your own timber) which inevitably means using bigger saws and cross-cutting to length before milling, there may be enough interest to warrant something?

 

Alec

[AA Teccie (Paul)]

As a couple of the 'above' post have, inadvertently, made reference to the issue of "refresher training" it would seem an opportune moment to mention that AFAG 805 'Training and Certification' has been updated and released.

 

See http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/afag805.pdf

 

They have placed a greater emphasis on 'consolidation' of skills, as a key factor in developing operator competence, and again highlighted the need for (effective) refresher / update training particulrly where 5 years have expired since previous training AND where advancements have been made in technologies and techniques...'climbing' / 'aerial rescue' and 'rigging' I would suggest are the key areas currently.

 

Further IF it was 15 years, or more, ago since you did your original training, say for tree felling, and you have a CS30/31 (or even CS10/11???), then why not undertake CS32 which will both refresh you original training AND mean you achieve a more advanced skill.

 

Thanks all..

Paul

[easy-lift guy]

Knowledge is power!, Go forth and seek what knowledge is available and have a nice day!

elg

[Charlieh]

As a couple of the 'above' post have, inadvertently, made reference to the issue of "refresher training" it would seem an opportune moment to mention that AFAG 805 'Training and Certification' has been updated and released.

 

See http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/afag805.pdf

 

Further IF it was 15 years, or more, ago since you did your original training, say for tree felling, and you have a CS30/31 (or even CS10/11???), then why not undertake CS32 which will both refresh you original training AND mean you achieve a more advanced skill.

 

Thanks all..

Paul

 

Although this is industry accepted as being suitable for refresher training in doing a new ticket, i know several large conservation bodies and utilities firms that wont accept this, they want to see refreshers for all courses still keeps LANTRA/NPTC in business i suppose

[AA Teccie (Paul)]

Although this is industry accepted as being suitable for refresher training in doing a new ticket, i know several large conservation bodies and utilities firms that wont accept this, they want to see refreshers for all courses still keeps LANTRA/NPTC in business i suppose

 

That's disappointing to hear, hugely frustrating, and, dare I say, demonstrates a lack of understanding of how the system works and, more importantly, how the skills develop and are applied.

 

What if the 'training provider' supplied a covering letter saying that CS31, for instance, had effectively been 'refreshed' by virtue of training undertakne for CS32...or is that too simple,?...hmmm!

 

Wherever possible, in applying H&S regs / industry good practice through the ArbAC scheme, we try to take a pragmatic view on things and training/competence is an area regularly involved and I often run things pass HSE who I have to say take a similarly pragmatic, rather than dogmatic (and often unworkable), approach.

 

Cheers..

Paul

Paul

[Canal Navvy]

That's disappointing to hear, hugely frustrating, and, dare I say, demonstrates a lack of understanding of how the system works and, more importantly, how the skills develop and are applied.

 

What if the 'training provider' supplied a covering letter saying that CS31, for instance, had effectively been 'refreshed' by virtue of training undertakne for CS32...or is that too simple,?...hmmm!

 

Wherever possible, in applying H&S regs / industry good practice through the ArbAC scheme, we try to take a pragmatic view on things and training/competence is an area regularly involved and I often run things pass HSE who I have to say take a similarly pragmatic, rather than dogmatic (and often unworkable), approach.

 

Cheers..

Paul

Paul

 

Well I am lost too. C.S.31 out of date for our insurers (as a volunteer). Would have done C.S.32 as an update but medium/large trees seems to be in confusion. Without better information I shall spend my work training budget

elsewhere.

[AardvarkTreeServices]

Speak to phil dunford at Chainsaw Training with Phil Dunford : Welcome to Phil's Chainsaw Training Website. He's based in cloaenog and I can't recommend him highly enough. I've done several courses with him and he's very professional but realistically practical