Starting a buisness- some advice!

[Mr Ed]

If you have money, i'd think very, very hard before sinking it into a tree surgery business

 

What he said!

[tockmal]

Being self employed is fine when you got work, when you don't it is frightening.

[Marc]

I hear you there Tockmal, my advice about going freelance, not sure what others think, is ring lots of people, get your name out there.

Even when you have plenty of work booked still ring round, and try to fit in a day here a day there with other companies.

I'd even travel upto 60 miles to work for other companies.

 

I had companies that would tell me to come in for the next few weeks, then tell me at short notice they did'nt need me i,e next day, which sucked.

 

I was lucky one company would have me any day I was free, even if it meant i'd be on the ground as a back up climber, which did'nt matter to me as my rate was the same no matter what I did.

 

 

 

Also one subbie I worked with had his own 7.5t truck and chipper, he sub's himself out as a unit at around £250 a day. And on days he was'nt booked he scheduled his own work.

Seemed a good way to do things, as you build up your own client base you can steadily go towards working for yourself and build your own company.

[Mr Ed]

rethinking this one, The business in question is utilities, there will always be powerline cutting. Even in recesion, this kind of work still needs doing, so not a bad business.

[RPA]

My self and two of my workmates are about to start out on our own. We are fed up of working dam hard and not being rewarded for our efforts, while our boss makes all the profit, but hasn't picked up a chainsaw for 10 years.

 

From your experience, what is one good piece of advice you'd give to someone about to start working for themselves?

 

 

I’m interested to see all the replies in this thread because I am in a very similar situation.

 

I currently have a ‘day job’ (not tree related) that pays £30K/year and the healthcare policy includes free double strength Prozac. Over a year ago I went to see a business advisor re setting up in tree work again after a 23 yr break. His advice was very simple – set up while you still have a day job. This way I can:

• have a safety net for the majority of set up costs

• learn about the marketplace

• learn about business (costing/pricing etc)

• develop a reputation

• develop a client base

• etc.

During this set up period my safety net will be the monthly cheque from my day job. I am currently building up a good reputation and a small client base (one of which has just phoned up to thank me for this years work and put me forward to their land agent to do the majority of next years £20K grant work). I appreciate that this will be different for you as your boss would not be too happy if you did the same thing!

 

One thing you should do is attend a free business start-up course. We have one being ran by our local business enterprise and I would advise you to do this – there is a lot more to it than us ‘employees’ realise!

 

I have had an offer of partnership from someone who attended a course with me. I feel the same way as most of the comments in that partnerships will ultimately end in tears. I have however proposed a compromise. The lad in question has his own ground maintenance/grass cutting business so we may be going down the road of ‘association’. If he gets tree work it will go through me and I will pay him as a subby and visa versa with the groundwork etc. This could still work with a group of you doing tree work as opposed to forming a company that employs you all.

 

Get the best kit you can afford. Any profit out of any of my jobs is going straight back into the business (saws/rigging equipment/blowers/etc). I did buy a cheap Toyota pickup for £450 but so far I have spent over £1000 on the barstuard, so that one is starting to back fire on me – literally!

 

As far as land goes I believe in buying everything I can as any form of rent is money you will never see again. I am looking for a very small piece of land to buy. Even if thing don’t work out the chances of not getting my money back on it is very slim.

 

Sorry I can’t offer any real advice bar what I am trying to do, hope it all works out for you:151:. I think the most important thing is to be happy. By being self employed you will stand chance of being rewarded for the effort and dedication you put into your job, but you must also balance this against the possibility of failure and what this will do to you, your family and those around you.

 

Richard.

[MattyF]

Get in with farmers i pay no rent for storing timber in a heap and only £10 a load for the unchipable stuff to be burnt also the farmers weekly did an article on the benifits on wood chip as cattle bedding and other uses i now have 5 new drops just as was filling my last one up!

[Will]

Thanks for all the replies guys.

 

An Update:

My boss has agreed to have us as self employed contractors and will give me as much HV and LV clearence as I want. We are still in discussions over rates for this, but its looking good so far.

This is excellent for me, as now I have a huge safety net while the private work is built up. For those of you that have never worked on powerlines, its not the best tree work in the world, but the money is good and the work never runs out. So the aim now is to try and have one or two good private jobs each week and do power lines for the rest of the time.

I've got some good leads from a few friends and farmers on where to store my equipment and wood etc, so many thanks for that idea, just hope the foot and mouth situation is cleared soon because that would be a nightmare.

[TimR]

Thanks for all the replies guys.

 

An Update:

My boss has agreed to have us as self employed contractors and will give me as much HV and LV clearence as I want. We are still in discussions over rates for this, but its looking good so far.

This is excellent for me, as now I have a huge safety net while the private work is built up. For those of you that have never worked on powerlines, its not the best tree work in the world, but the money is good and the work never runs out. So the aim now is to try and have one or two good private jobs each week and do power lines for the rest of the time.

I've got some good leads from a few friends and farmers on where to store my equipment and wood etc, so many thanks for that idea, just hope the foot and mouth situation is cleared soon because that would be a nightmare.

from when i used to do this ( omg over 10 years ago) my only advice to watch out for is "wet days" not sure how th current method of line clearance is done with regards to these but winter time is coming and im sure a lot of these as well so make sure you have allowances for these .hope it all works out for you.

[ArbjobsNick]

My self and two of my workmates are about to start out on our own. We are fed up of working dam hard and not being rewarded for our efforts, while our boss makes all the profit, but hasn't picked up a chainsaw for 10 years.

 

From your experience, what is one good piece of advice you'd give to someone about to start working for themselves?

 

 

Before you start you really need to analyse the potential earnings against hours spent quoting maintaining and fixing kit, and carrying out the work. Take from these costs taxation depreciation on kit (it will need replacing at some point) marketing (you will need to advertise and this isn't cheap) and running costs including yard rental etc. Then remove days not worked due to bad weather and breakdowns holidays etc and I think if you do the sums and are realistic you will find that you will probably be working your nuts 60 hours a week for only a few more quid than you are currently earning. Then include the effects the stress of running your own business will have on your social and family life. Then decide if it still sounds so rosey, I know we have all wanted to set up on our own and some of us did it, but it isn't easy make sure you have a pit of money for the first year borrow as little as possible from the bank, they sometimes want it back at the most inappropriate moments! and try and take as little from the business as possible for the first year. I hope I haven't put you off but having been there myself I wish someone had told me all this fifteen years ago. Good luck, Nick

[tockmal]

Before you start you really need to analyse the potential earnings against hours spent quoting maintaining and fixing kit, and carrying out the work. Take from these costs taxation depreciation on kit (it will need replacing at some point) marketing (you will need to advertise and this isn't cheap) and running costs including yard rental etc. Then remove days not worked due to bad weather and breakdowns holidays etc and I think if you do the sums and are realistic you will find that you will probably be working your nuts 60 hours a week for only a few more quid than you are currently earning. Then include the effects the stress of running your own business will have on your social and family life. Then decide if it still sounds so rosey, I know we have all wanted to set up on our own and some of us did it, but it isn't easy make sure you have a pit of money for the first year borrow as little as possible from the bank, they sometimes want it back at the most inappropriate moments! and try and take as little from the business as possible for the first year. I hope I haven't put you off but having been there myself I wish someone had told me all this fifteen years ago. Good luck, Nick

 

Your view is a tad negative Nick,

 

The fact is...the only way to make decent money in arboriculture in the UK is by working for yourself.

 

Since I have become self employed my financial income has increased greatly. I enjoy the challenge of finding work and maintaining a professional work ethic.

 

I would strongly advise any climbers who are thinking of going self-employed to do it, it will be worth it in the long run, just don't run out and buy loads of expensive equipment, start small and work your way into it. If you ever find yourself getting low on work just call a few companies and do some sub-contract climbing to get through the quiet period. Work with other guys in the same situation.

 

There are far too many employers and companies who act like leeches.......only too willing to exploit their climbers, paying them low wages whilst using their skills to build their company's name.

 

If your a good climber you will be aware of that feeling when you have just spent the whole day distmantling a huge tree then finding out the massive profit your boss is making from your skills and efforts.

 

Being self-employed is liberating, you get what you put in, so if you are enthusiastic about treework, good with clients and a hard worker you will get a lot back in return.