Police incompetence!!!!!!!!

[Andy Collins]

I disagree that the incident was "incompetence", and think its unfair to call it as such. I dont know the area, I dont know the protocol within the police service re: these incidents, therefore I'd feel totally unqualified to praise or criticise. I would like to see all Police officers fire-arms trained (not PCSOs!!) with access and permissions to "protect and serve" the public. If this then meant an officer had to requisition a local persons firearm to do his duty and prevent further bloodshed, then at least he has the training. Unfortunately, the criminal seems to have more rights than the police or the public, so I'd presume all attempts were made to take him alive, hoping he would hole up and be talked down. I think protocol for these incidents is formed on past experiences, and obviously lessons are learned from each and every one. Its easy to sit here and say what you would have done, and i dont doubt for one minute one or two here would have a go. The incident took place over a 3hour period, could none of you within that 3hr window have not driven over and given the police a hand, or is it just talk? After all, its only 2hrs 16mins from huddersfield to cumbria, so you'd still get 45mins to find and disable the criminal:001_smile:

Edited June 9, 2010 by Andy Collins

[ad15]

...and the reason it's horse poop ??

 

 

 

My reasoning is two of my friends are firearms officers and together we have carried out firearms demonstrations at a village show we organise, if you wish to attend this show and discuss the matter with them, I'm sure they will enlighten you, I can even give you his mobile if you wish.

 

I have also coached the Police shooting team for pistol, on the ranges, all firearms officers so have spent a lot of time with them. I have also had FAO's join me game shooting who have never owned a shotgun.

 

On that documentary police with cameras, it followed a female FAO on training, she admitted applying and being accepted into firearms with zero firearms experience ....fact

 

Perhaps the word "most" was a little harsh, I'll change that to "many" and stand rigidly by my statement.

 

So in fact not "many" but "ONE"....

 

I'll keep my relationship to any FAO to myself..

[Dean Lofthouse]

So in fact not "many" but "ONE"....

 

I'll keep my relationship to any FAO to myself..

 

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I'm sorry but it is fact mate, you keeping things to yourself is not backing up your comment.

 

I am also friends with one of the officers that shot MEN EZEZ, (spelt wrong to prevent google search) and have known him a long time. Again, no firearms experience previously

 

Andy, not in my wildest dreams or that of anyone else would you have expected police to allow a gunman to wander around slaughtering people for three hours mate and me travelling up there with firearms is a deliberate act and warrants prison, if it had been on my street and I took him out I would get away with it and be hailed a hero

[chezchops]

Those who have little knowledge should say little. Wiser to await the facts and make informed judgement than show ignorance.:

[skyhuck]

I disagree that the incident was "incompetence", and think its unfair to call it as such. I dont know the area, I dont know the protocol within the police service re: these incidents, therefore I'd feel totally unqualified to praise or criticise. I would like to see all Police officers fire-arms trained (not PCSOs!!) with access and permissions to "protect and serve" the public. If this then meant an officer had to requisition a local persons firearm to do his duty and prevent further bloodshed, then at least he has the training. Unfortunately, the criminal seems to have more rights than the police or the public, so I'd presume all attempts were made to take him alive, hoping he would hole up and be talked down. I think protocol for these incidents is formed on past experiences, and obviously lessons are learned from each and every one. Its easy to sit here and say what you would have done, and i dont doubt for one minute one or two here would have a go. The incident took place over a 3hour period, could none of you within that 3hr window have not driven over and given the police a hand, or is it just talk? After all, its only 2hrs 16mins from huddersfield to cumbria, so you'd still get 45mins to find and disable the criminal:001_smile:

 

Unfortunatly Andy it would seem there was little or no effort made to take him alive, dead or other wise.

 

Really it seems to me from what I have heard and seen, that in real turms the poilce did nothing but secure crime scenes after he was long gone and it would appear their own safety was their main priority.

[skyhuck]

Those who have little knowledge should say little. Wiser to await the facts and make informed judgement than show ignorance.:

 

OKay so we should all shut up and only speak about things we are experts in?? .

 

Its the "lounge", its a forum, opinions are the whole point, IMO .

 

If you disagree with me thats fine

[scotspine1]

MEN EZEZ, (spelt wrong to prevent google search)

 

Dean, I think you'll find it's 'spelled wrong'

 

The Cumbrian police probably never even had a training scenario for this kind of incident, unlike say the Metropolitan, Manchester or Strathclyde forces who regularly train for incidents like this. Maybe there is now a need to have four forces in the UK for each country, instead of regional forces?

[Dean Lofthouse]

Those who have little knowledge should say little. Wiser to await the facts and make informed judgement than show ignorance.:

 

The facts are already there and seen as now they are not going to carry out an investigation then those are the facts we have to work with

[Dean Lofthouse]

Dean, I think you'll find it's 'spelled wrong'

 

The Cumbrian police probably never even had a training scenario for this kind of incident, unlike say the Metropolitan, Manchester or Strathclyde forces who regularly train for incidents like this.

 

I doubt that very much Tim, the clue is in the place name "Sellefield" a prime terrorist target. It would not be good to have a local police force made up of farmers with pitch forks and catapults

[Dave D]

Its easy to criticise when you dont have all the facts. only cumbria police have all the facts, and in time they may come to light. I think we should stick to talkin trees instead of thinking we know about police protocol and how we could do it better. I dont think they will be talkin trees on a police forum.