CS39 - what exactly does it allow you to do?

[markieg31]

o and i also have my cs40. so i suppose i could prune the tree to the ground:lol:

[likeitorlumpit]

All very interesting.

We have been using a climber who trained at Merrist Wood- got a distinction

Had the usual 30/31/38/39 but he assumed he was OK to do complicated dismantles and technical pruning (40/41) as did I. They possibly didn't go into the restrictions. That says it all. He's currently a lead climber for a firm. Have to say, he's an excellent climber- possibly the best I've worked with. His competence far outweighs any I know who have the superior tickets but I'm assuming now he is climbing without insurance for what he is doing.

They don't take intelligence into account when they say you need tickets to prove competence.

Hope this makes sense- I know there's loads out there who similarly assume cs39 is the be all and end all.

[nz paul]

Ive came into the uk 6 yrs ago and went through all the tickets i told i would need to cut and climb,was told by the assessors i didnt need 40,41.I worked for various company's,councils, sub contracted etc.. and still haven't needed them,and have hardly met anyone who has had them and the few they did i don't know how they actually obtained them. My two cents.

[Tony.Price]

When answering this question we must look at the legislation and industry best practice guidance; After all, this is what we are aspiring to abide by as professionals and not want to fall short should an incident occur.

 

For employers/employees and the self employed, it is made perfectly clear under the HSAWA, MHSWR, PUWER, LOLER, WAHR, BS399 2010, INDG guides and AFAG guides etc. In summary, persons in the work place must be trained and competent to undertake the tasks in front of them in a safe manner.

 

The proof of training/experience and so competence in our industry has been led recently by the awarding of Cs units. This is now shortly to be confused with other awards now available from LA and renaming of the CS units by C&G NPTC.

 

Training and assessment for both the old Cs 39 and the new 'AWARD IN AERIAL CUTTING OF TREES WITH A CHAINSAW USING FREE-FALL TECHNIQUES' did not and does not include working from climbing spurs cutting the main tree stem or the use of pull lines. It is strongly aimed as an introduction to aerial works involving removal of branches only, tasks such as crown lifting and target pruning.

 

According to the Evaluation of current rigging and dismantling practices used in arboriculture (http://www.hse.gov.uk/research/rrpdf/rr668.pdf), it is made perfectly clear that the undertaking of dismantling operations requires the operatives to have been awarded certs of competence in the field of work and in addition to have an experienced individual in the team. Greatly relevant here!

 

The holding of unit Cs 39 alone does not suggest they have achieved training on the sectional dismantling of a tree nor pruning of a tree and so the employer/employee or the self employed would be putting themselves at risk of prosecution under the various legislation mentioned, should they employ those individuals to undertake such tasks without adequate supervision.

 

Further Questions: (food for thought)

 

What response would an insurer have should an incident occur involving an individual without the appropriate awards for the tasks undertaken as per industry best practice?

 

Are we who we say we are, 'fully qualified'?

 

If you do not hold all the awards relevant to the tasks you undertake, why not?

 

If you do hold all the awards relevant to the tasks you undertake, do you refresh your training at the recommended intervals; if not, why not?

 

Tony

[Dan Earp]

Cheers tony, in ref to the insurer i was only asked if i held a cs39 and didn't have to provide any evidence.

 

 

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[Gaz29]

one of my colleagues has cs30, cs31, cs38 and cs39 and that is all that is required for him to climb for the forest of dean forestry commission and i always thought they where really strict, there basic chainsaw maintenance and felling like a cs30/31 is a lot more difficult