Stihl MSA200c battery charging issue after inactivity.

[Fatboy2017]

I have a Stihl MSA200c  cordless chainsaw, was used 6 months ago and charged up fine no issues. Had a couple of jobs to do which required a cordless saw, battery showed no lights even though battery, a AP200, was left with approx 75% charge when put away. 

On connecting the charger (AL101) lights up solid green for 3 seconds or so then goes quickly to red, then al lights go out.

The Stihl service info I've read does not mention this code situation. Any ideas? New batteries are horrendous cost so trying to recover this one. I have many saws so not stuck for an alternative but find this one very useful for jobs it's designed for. @mark-skyland? 

[kram]

Assuming the battery has no warranty, batteries can usually be recovered. Lithium cells like to burn if not used properly so this takes some care. Do it in a fireproof, dry place.

 

AP200 is a 20 cell, 10 series 2 parallel battery, 10x 2.5Ah cells in series to get 36v, two rows of 10 in parallel to get 5Ah.

 

The first check is using a multimeter on the + and - tabs, what is the overall battery voltage?

 

Chargers usually refuse to charge cells that have dropped below about 1.5v.

With the battery opened up, the next check is how well it is balanced - check each pair and note it down.

 

If any are below 1.5v they need to be charged slow, at 100mA or so.

Buy a cheap RC charger - few go up to 10 cells so you will have to individually charge every pair, or you could charge 5 pairs at a time with balance leads.

 

Once its recovered it should charge normally on the stihl charger.

Edited 7 hours ago by kram

[Fatboy2017]

Thanks for info.  I will try to take in what you suggested, electrics are not my thing but I'll have a go.

[Muddy42]

Was the battery left outside or very cold by any chance?  Maybe try bringing into the warmth for a while before charging.

[openspaceman]

1 hour ago, kram said:

Assuming the battery has no warranty, batteries can usually be recovered. Lithium cells like to burn if not used properly so this takes some care. Do it in a fireproof, dry place.

 

AP200 is a 20 cell, 10 series 2 parallel battery, 10x 2.5Ah cells in series to get 36v, two rows of 10 in parallel to get 5Ah.

 

The first check is using a multimeter on the + and - tabs, what is the overall battery voltage?

 

Chargers usually refuse to charge cells that have dropped below about 1.5v.

With the battery opened up, the next check is how well it is balanced - check each pair and note it down.

 

If any are below 1.5v they need to be charged slow, at 100mA or so.

Buy a cheap RC charger - few go up to 10 cells so you will have to individually charge every pair, or you could charge 5 pairs at a time with balance leads.

 

Once its recovered it should charge normally on the stihl charger.

Good post @kram. It's a bit like smart chargers for a car battery won't work if the battery is profoundly flat so you have to kickstart it with another good battery across the terminals.

 

There is a good reason for this and that is the electrolyte in a lithium cobalt battery is flammable, if there is a fault in the circuit the charging current heats a cell up until it ignites the electrolyte.

 

I recover batteries that have been left too long by opening them up and using a usb  charger attaching it with  small magnets one cell at a time.

[AHPP]

17 minutes ago, openspaceman said:

It's a bit like smart chargers for a car battery won't work if the battery is profoundly flat so you have to kickstart it with another good battery across the terminals.

 

I bought a fairly expensive battery jump pack (fairly large Noco one). Doesn't work. Smart shit is mostly shit.

[openspaceman]

10 minutes ago, AHPP said:

 

I bought a fairly expensive battery jump pack (fairly large Noco one). Doesn't work. Smart shit is mostly shit.

I have one from my daughter that packed up for just the reason discussed above, I recharged it but it had lost a lot of capacity and is not much use other than the usb port now. I think they all have pouch cells rather than cylindrical ones as these have a higher discharge current but shorter life.

 

The silly thing is I advised her to buy a cheap lead acid one as her's was an EV that kept discharging the 12V battery, so it wouldn't start, it only needed to produce 12V and a small current to close the contactor on the main battery. Eventually sorted with a firmware upgrade, hence it just got left in the glove box for 3 years.

 

Her new EV (MG4) just came to a halt in traffic and put itself into park before disconnecting everything, no warning. Had to be manually released and towed off. Turns out it was a temperature sensor in the heater circuit reading high. I remember the days when you had an oil pressure light, a temperature gauge and a charge warning light on before the car was not driveable.

[pleasant]

The problem with battery stuff is theres little to no warning before it stops working. Its like a light bulb you can have it lit all day, then next it will fail....no warning. This is what i am finding with pro users who are starting to realise that is very much the case. At least with a petrol machine there is a degree of pre warning there is an issue before it finally packs up meaning the issue can potentially be addressed overnight before another 8 hours of work the next day. 

[Peter 1955]

2 hours ago, openspaceman said:

Turns out it was a temperature sensor in the heater circuit reading high. I remember the days when you had an oil pressure light, a temperature gauge and a charge warning light on before the car was not driveable.

I heard about an expensive one the other day. A fire broke out in a cornfield, and a big posh tractor was sent with a set of discs or similar to create a fire break. Basically, the machine decided it was too hot, and for safety, it needed to shut itself down totally. Not really the best course of action. 

The one that really irks me is on the forklifts and similar when you overload the lift, and it locks up. Why doesn't it let you lower the boom to release the overload?   

[AHPP]

Resist that kind of nonsense. Get the manufacturer to show you it. Stick the brochures up their noses and show them the door, centurion. Treat them very roughly.