Can an Elm survive Dutch Elm disease?

[AnnieDee]

Hi there, 

I have a large Elm tree in my garden and had a council worker come round to tell me it had Dutch Elm disease and that it would be dead within 6 weeks. That was mid August 2023. It did not die and after winter it now looks very much like a beautiful healthy tree.

I understand that the disease spreads when the beetles move in and start to eat the dying/dead bark however there is no sign of beetle. I am not questioning whether the diagnosis is correct as I believe that it is, however I'm being pushed into chopping it down now, when it does not yet seem to be a threat to other trees.

I appreciate that the idea is to get rid of it before it becomes a risk however the immediate local area has many trees marked up as having the disease (a spray painted orange X) and they have not yet been dealt with. As in, council owned land and the park immediately outside my house has infected trees that the council has left and not got round to yet for a couple of years (probably responsible for the infection of my own tree!)

It's a sad situation but I'd just like some advice on whether I should wait and see a bit longer (maybe my Elm will fight it off and be a survivor?)... It has already massively defied the expert's prediction that it would be dead within 6 weeks. Or if I should get on with chopping it down and get the council off my back, even though it feels like I'd be killing a beautiful and pretty healthy looking tree. 

For additional confusion, the council have said that they will chop it down at their own cost- but I have a week to confirm.

If I'm enforced to do it in the future then I'd be paying for the chop myself which would be pretty difficult financially.

Any thoughts would be welcome, I'm so sad about losing this tree but am in no way an arborist so don't know if I should be fighting for it's rights or letting it go  

[Peasgood]

Even when they are leafless and dead from DED they take a long time to actually fall down. It would stay up for many years causing no more risk than any other tree.

Tell them to bugger off and you will do it when it is dead if it ever happens.

 

[GarethM]

If it's FREE then take up the offer, it's a few hundred quid you don't have to pay 🙂.

 

Maybe say you're so worried about the beetles, I think it needs stump grinding as part of the deal!.

Edited May 26 by GarethM

[Rich Rule]

What evidence do they have of DED?

 

we deal with it a lot in Norway and that doesn’t look that bad.  Obviously it is hard to determine exactly from a couple of picture.

 

Are there limbs that are dying off, going brown?

 

Have they seen evidence of the beetle?

 

If there are dying limbs they can be pruned out but it is best not to cut into live wood when the temps are over 20c.  That is when the beetle is active.  So if surrounding trees are affected by DED there is a high chance the beetle work move into the tree in your property.

 

 

[Squaredy]

5 hours ago, AnnieDee said:

Hi there, 

I have a large Elm tree in my garden and had a council worker come round to tell me it had Dutch Elm disease and that it would be dead within 6 weeks. That was mid August 2023. It did not die and after winter it now looks very much like a beautiful healthy tree.

I understand that the disease spreads when the beetles move in and start to eat the dying/dead bark however there is no sign of beetle. I am not questioning whether the diagnosis is correct as I believe that it is, however I'm being pushed into chopping it down now, when it does not yet seem to be a threat to other trees.

I appreciate that the idea is to get rid of it before it becomes a risk however the immediate local area has many trees marked up as having the disease (a spray painted orange X) and they have not yet been dealt with. As in, council owned land and the park immediately outside my house has infected trees that the council has left and not got round to yet for a couple of years (probably responsible for the infection of my own tree!)

It's a sad situation but I'd just like some advice on whether I should wait and see a bit longer (maybe my Elm will fight it off and be a survivor?)... It has already massively defied the expert's prediction that it would be dead within 6 weeks. Or if I should get on with chopping it down and get the council off my back, even though it feels like I'd be killing a beautiful and pretty healthy looking tree. 

For additional confusion, the council have said that they will chop it down at their own cost- but I have a week to confirm.

If I'm enforced to do it in the future then I'd be paying for the chop myself which would be pretty difficult financially.

Any thoughts would be welcome, I'm so sad about losing this tree but am in no way an arborist so don't know if I should be fighting for it's rights or letting it go  

Which area are you in?  If you are in or near Brighton it is very different from most parts of the UK.

[AnnieDee]

Hia, I'm in Edinburgh, would love to be in Brighton though!

[AnnieDee]

There were some signs last summer, a few branches going a bit 'shepherd's crook' and some withered leaves but right now it looks great. I was shown the marking inside a small branch too so I'm sure it does have DED, but I would just like to give it a bit longer to see if it might fight it off (is that a completely fantastical concept, do they definitely always die?

There's no sign of Beetles, I think they only move in when it's properly dying is that right? And is it pretty much guaranteed that the Beetles will come along (or not)?

I'm just frustrated as it feels like the council are using a sledgehammer to crack a nut here, especially given that they haven't dealt with their own infected trees which are still standing long after having an X spray- painted on them...

[openspaceman]

1 hour ago, AnnieDee said:

There's no sign of Beetles, I think they only move in when it's properly dying is that right?

The beetles carry the fungus, the females lay eggs under the bark and the larva  eat their way out, so the phloem layer has to be thick enough. Once hatched out the beetles then eat the leaf stalks and this infects a new part of the elm. The presence of the fungus triggers a response from the tree to block the fungus spreading, If the infection is present throughout the annual ring this  response prevents sap flowing, hence the parts of the tree upstream wilt and die.

[daltontrees]

On 26/05/2024 at 15:10, Peasgood said:

Even when they are leafless and dead from DED they take a long time to actually fall down. It would stay up for many years causing no more risk than any other tree.

Tell them to bugger off and you will do it when it is dead if it ever happens.

 

That's not a helpful attitude. After they get infected they stand as 'breeders' for several years afterwards and leaving a breeder in place launches a huge number of beetles that then infect other trees. It's not about risk of harm, it's about minimising spread of DED.

Instead of telling the Council to bugger off, do you not stop and wonder why they're patrolling the city trying to catch early infections so that they can keep as many of the elm population as possible. 

[daltontrees]

On 26/05/2024 at 11:54, AnnieDee said:

Any thoughts would be welcome, I'm so sad about losing this tree but am in no way an arborist so don't know if I should be fighting for it's rights or letting it go  

 

It sholdn't be a fight, the Council is only trying to control the spread of DED. As far as I know there are only 2 places this happens, Brighton (which is partly isolated by geography from othe DED areas) and Edinburgh which is a World Heritage Centre and has a lot of good elms still that are important for the amenity of the city.

The Council might get it wrong sometimes. A section of yellowing leaves could be early DED or it could be a bit of storm damage or other causes. Maybe that's what happened here. If you ask the Council they will come out and re-appraise, as they keep records of all suspected DED cases. Let them see it close-up. They can't make you remove it, but it's some testament to their sense of purpose that they might be willing to pay to remove it.

[Muddy42]

1 hour ago, daltontrees said:

It sholdn't be a fight, the Council is only trying to control the spread of DED. As far as I know there are only 2 places this happens, Brighton (which is partly isolated by geography from othe DED areas) and Edinburgh which is a World Heritage Centre and has a lot of good elms still that are important for the amenity of the city.

The Council might get it wrong sometimes. A section of yellowing leaves could be early DED or it could be a bit of storm damage or other causes. Maybe that's what happened here. If you ask the Council they will come out and re-appraise, as they keep records of all suspected DED cases. Let them see it close-up. They can't make you remove it, but it's some testament to their sense of purpose that they might be willing to pay to remove it.

 

I wasn't aware this was the policy in Brighton and Edinburgh, that's interesting.  I hope it works and isn't a fruitless fight - most tree diseases seem to march across the country eventually - Phytophthora ramorum, ash dieback, grey squirrels.  Are there any examples of this policy working?