Problems and issues this industry faces and how to deal with them.

[Mick Dempsey]

Just now, Retired Climber said:

 

It's one of the reasons that employed arb salaries are so low. This has a detrimental effect on the industry, who wants to work within it, and who wants to try to make a career out of it. 

 

We can call ourselves skilled professionals all we like, but it's the market's perception that largely dictates rates of pay. If an industry has the ' thick kid's job' image, it's hard to drag the pay out of the gutter. 

 

 

 

 

I don’t agree.

The money is what it is, it’s not the market’s perception that dictates pay, it’s the supply and demand of capable climbers that dictates the pay.

 

 

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

I can knock the skin off this rice pudding straight away....

 

As Mick says - who cares what a toffee nosed tee owner or that fat prick that wrote the article for the arb magazine thinks...  You tell me what you want doing, I'll tell you what I'd suggest, if we meet in the middle we'll agree a price for my service, I'll do what I set out to do and you'll pay me.

 

If, as occasionally happens, we get on really well, we might end up as pals.  If as occasionally happens, both parties are just happy that a good deal was done, that's fine and finally, if, as occasionally happens, we fall out, we'll part under what ever circumstances materialise.

 

I couldn't give a monkeys if someone thinks I'm a thicko for doing a job I love, when I want to, how I want to, where I want to and only ever for WHO I want to at a price that I set.

 

Problems in the industry?  I don't see 'em.

 

 

[nath]

If you want the answer to why we are not taking seriously as professionals just spend an hour on various social media channels and look at how some people within the industry portray themselves, then you have your answer. Probably these same people who are complaining we aren't taken seriously as an industry 😁

[Retired Climber]

5 minutes ago, Mick Dempsey said:

I don’t agree.

The money is what it is, it’s not the market’s perception that dictates pay, it’s the supply and demand of capable climbers that dictates the pay.

 

 

I'd say completely the opposite. How do you think the 'going rate' for a job is set? It's the market and the perceived value that dictate price. We, as business owners, need to work out the best way to get the job done for somewhere near the price the market dictates to us. 

 

When Mrs Miggins decides to have you in to do some formative pruning, you aren't just competing on price with other arbs, you are competing with the new sofa, the holiday, or new wardrobe she could have instead of a nicely pruned tree. Your price can only rise to the point at which she would still prefer the tree work over the holiday. Part of this decision is based on the value she puts on you and your time, and not just the value of having a nice tree. The 'sod you, I'm not paying that' limit  is very powerful. 

 

I agree that a shortage of climbers should put prices up, in theory, but what may actually happen is that less competent climbers simply fill the void. 

[Mick Dempsey]

My post was about climbers pay.

 

 

 

[Retired Climber]

19 minutes ago, kevinjohnsonmbe said:

I can knock the skin off this rice pudding straight away....

 

As Mick says - who cares what a toffee nosed tee owner or that fat prick that wrote the article for the arb magazine thinks...  You tell me what you want doing, I'll tell you what I'd suggest, if we meet in the middle we'll agree a price for my service, I'll do what I set out to do and you'll pay me.

 

If, as occasionally happens, we get on really well, we might end up as pals.  If as occasionally happens, both parties are just happy that a good deal was done, that's fine and finally, if, as occasionally happens, we fall out, we'll part under what ever circumstances materialise.

 

I couldn't give a monkeys if someone thinks I'm a thicko for doing a job I love, when I want to, how I want to, where I want to and only ever for WHO I want to at a price that I set.

 

Problems in the industry?  I don't see 'em.

 

 

Whilst I agree with you from a micro-economics viewpoint, and agree that the approach will work for invividuals and their businesses, to fix an industry we surely need to concentrate on the macro environment. 

Whether we like it or not, prices are limited by the market's avoidance of cognitive dissonance; they simply can't bring themselves to pay above a certain level for someone doing a working class job. 

[Retired Climber]

1 minute ago, Mick Dempsey said:

My post was about climbers pay.

 

 

 

I know. Same rules apply. 

[Mick Dempsey]

 

11 minutes ago, Retired Climber said:

Whilst I agree with you from a micro-economics viewpoint, and agree that the approach will work for invividuals and their businesses, to fix an industry we surely need to concentrate on the macro environment. 

Whether we like it or not, prices are limited by the market's avoidance of cognitive dissonance; they simply can't bring themselves to pay above a certain level for someone doing a working class job. 

You’re wrong, they’ll pay what it costs.

Not all in fact not much of tree work is formative pruning that people can make a choice about.

Big trees near houses, dead stuff etc. HAS to be done.

Edited August 21, 2022 by Mick Dempsey
Wanted to add stuff.

[Retired Climber]

13 minutes ago, Mick Dempsey said:

 

You’re wrong, they’ll pay what it costs.

Not all in fact not much of tree work is formative pruning that people can make a choice about.

Big trees near houses, dead stuff etc. HAS to be done.

If all the pruning, hedge cutting and other non-essential jobs reduce due to cost there will be less work generally. How do you think that will effect the prices of the essential jobs? 

[Mick Dempsey]

If my aunt had bollocks she’d be my uncle.

 

Look we’re going round in circles, I’ll leave it for a bit

 

 

Edited August 21, 2022 by Mick Dempsey
Started drinking, watching footy.