Solo Working with Chainsaws - Would extra safety measures be beneficial?

[DanHorrich87]

1 hour ago, LeaLea910 said:

 

Thank you for taking the time to replying and offering your thought.

Potential kits to include but not exclusive to- 

HaemoCap™ pressure dressing
PELI Waterproof Hard Case or Belt Pouch

CAT 7th Generation Tourniquet

QuickClot Dressing

Compressed Responder Gauze 

FOX Chest Seal 

Emergency Haemorrhage Control Trauma Wound Bandage Dressing

Trauma Shears

Medi Gloves
Thermal Emergency Foil Blanket

 

It will allow quick response and action. Hopefully never needed. What do you think? 

Many Thanks

I was wondering if you were marketing a new quick acting, quick drying coagulant glue-spray that a lone operator could apply before mobiling for help.

 

Pads & gauzes nevermind tourniquets are a faff, particularly one handed.

 

Have you experience of trauma induced shock? I've seen it. Find one product, easy to carry, easy to apply and proven by experts and you may have a seller. 🙂

[Haironyourchest]

Celox rapid z-fold in a zippered chest pocket for climbing. Got to be one hand, either hand, deployable. Lone working, even lone climbing, is a thing. We live in a time of cotton wool culture which is incompatible with the economic reality of some operators. Most often, reality wins... risk mitigation measures and extreme caution will have to suffice.

 

People react differently to extreme injury and sudden amputation. There's no way to know how an individual will react until it happens. This has been demonstrated innumerable times by battlefield reports. An interesting read is "A treatise on musket ball wounds" (or something titled along those lines) from the American civil war. It was noted by the field surgeons that some soldiers would lose an arm to a cannon ball, casually twist their handkerchief around the stump and mooch on over to the hospital tent. Others would freak out and faint from a relatively minor bullet wound and think it was much worse than it actually was... 

[Doug Tait]

I carry Cellox Clotting Granules, Israeli Bandage, CAT Tourniquet and Whistle as a personal kit.

And hope that I'm able to use it if I have to.

 

Just as important as carrying the first aid stuff, for lone working, is your planning. Particularly having someone (with a copy of your risk assessment) that you will contact at agreed intervals and if you don't respond they have the relevant details ready to raise the alarm.

[jarborist]

Stein do various specific bleed kits.

Is it time chainsaw trouser manufacturers had a dedicated waterproof , accessible (when wearing harness) thigh pocket. I know a lot have various pockets around the right area but always seems to me a lot of room for improvement. Check out the tourniquet stein use - it's called swat . Don't know how good it is in real use but it packs up small 

[Lowestoft Firewood]

I'd like to see someone with the sense of mind to apply a CAT after suffering a bleed serious enough to need one. 

 

They are hard to apply single handedly properly in training let alone with blood spurting all over the show and you rapidly losing consciousness.

 

I also definitely wouldn't be hanging around in the tree to try and get something out of a bag on my harness which has to be cinched on tight so it doesn't get stuck on every branch. 

[LeaLea910]

On 07/02/2022 at 17:58, Dbikeguy said:

Anything on a belt won’t work for climbing unless it’s small enough to go on the harness, but tough enough to deal with banging into the tree etc.
If it’s on the back of your harness it’s not much use, same as if on the ground, you will struggle to access it if it’s behind you.
I have a peli case with a full kit inc eye wash etc that can be bought out the truck on jobs further from it, then keep a cat tourniquet and a trauma bandage in my thigh side pockets so easy access one handed for me or others.

Decent shears are worth having as chainsaw kit is tough if you need to remove anything to access the wound.

Thank you so much for your reply @Dbikeguy.
All interesting and worthwhile points. I'm trying to now think of clip-on facility to be able to climb and then attach it to the line so not in the way, won't affect the line (safety) and reachable if needed. I'm considering everything here so please bare with me. 
Quick extra thought - What are the chances if you were to have an injury whilst at height, that you'll be able to descend OR do you think it would be necessary to do immediate treatment before descending? Once I have done some more research like this would you be up for receiving a kit to give me some further feedback maybe? 
Thanks again for your time.

[LeaLea910]

On 07/02/2022 at 19:31, DanHorrich87 said:

I was wondering if you were marketing a new quick acting, quick drying coagulant glue-spray that a lone operator could apply before mobiling for help.

 

Pads & gauzes nevermind tourniquets are a faff, particularly one handed.

 

Have you experience of trauma induced shock? I've seen it. Find one product, easy to carry, easy to apply and proven by experts and you may have a seller. 🙂

Hi Dan,

Noted that one handed treatment and application will be necessary. And yes I also agree a tourniquet and bandages are a faff - even for the professionals. I have experienced it yes, I did 10 years emergency services and do know from that, that bleed-stopping could be much more widely used if people had the knowledge and tools to hand. However, medical care is a busy industry so I just want to make sure that there is need/use for such solutions or if perhaps it's just something that is best left alone. Could we save more lives or are we creating more faff? I like your simplistic conclusion and yes, this would be ideal! 
Thank you as always for your time.

[LeaLea910]

On 07/02/2022 at 20:36, Haironyourchest said:

Celox rapid z-fold in a zippered chest pocket for climbing. Got to be one hand, either hand, deployable. Lone working, even lone climbing, is a thing. We live in a time of cotton wool culture which is incompatible with the economic reality of some operators. Most often, reality wins... risk mitigation measures and extreme caution will have to suffice.

 

People react differently to extreme injury and sudden amputation. There's no way to know how an individual will react until it happens. This has been demonstrated innumerable times by battlefield reports. An interesting read is "A treatise on musket ball wounds" (or something titled along those lines) from the American civil war. It was noted by the field surgeons that some soldiers would lose an arm to a cannon ball, casually twist their handkerchief around the stump and mooch on over to the hospital tent. Others would freak out and faint from a relatively minor bullet wound and think it was much worse than it actually was... 

Thank you for your time in replying in such detail and for the reference document too. I just had a look and actually, it looks like an interesting read. I'll probably read it in sections though.

You are absolutely right in that 'Health and Safety' although all well and good on paper, takes a back seat still in many situations and lone working and 'getting the job done' industries are most likely to overlook it and are usually most at risk. Even footing a ladder which seems simple and easy to do still gets forgotten. 
I guess when you compare it to soldiers on the battlefield, they carry morphine in their upper arm pocket (I confess I might be naive here as perhaps seen too many movies!) and a tourniquet in the same space.  Which is no good if that is the arm in trouble but absolutely better than nothing. 

Do we need more safety provisions or do we need to just be or to act more safely? Are injuries inevitable and can we just reduce them. After all, prevention is better than a cure.
Thank you again. 

[Haironyourchest]

7 hours ago, LeaLea910 said:

Do we need more safety provisions or do we need to just be or to act more safely? Are injuries inevitable and can we just reduce them. After all, prevention is better than a cure.
Thank you again. 

The certainly are preventable. But it takes time, patience and discipline on several levels.

 

Level 1.  Mentally planning the work. Visualisation. Really thinking about it, as opposed to looking at it and thinking about girls.

 

Level 2.   Steady, considered, deliberate movement. Better than optimal positioning. Preparation in little things.

 

Level 3.   Self awareness of energy levels and mental concentration reserves. When the battery is drained you stop, no ifs no buts. You stop and recharge, properly, or go home.

 

Level 4.   All the ancillary risk assessment forms, insurances, first aid gadgets etc, while well and good,  cannot compare with the preceding three levels.

 

The issue with this ethos is TIME. It takes time, a recourse many do not have. It is what it is, you either got time, or not, or you change your life to make time, or you don't... Anything can be done safely and with "virtually" no risk, if you take your time...

 

Let's take painting a window sill.... I'm talking about tying off a ladder with a rope through the top rung, big knot each side, 45 degree angle down to eyebolts set in the bottom of the wall, and a bolt-on footing to stop it kicking out. Climb the ladder with a positioning harness, short lanyard and prussic, clip to top rung, with no slack... This set up might take half an hour to set up. But there is no way you're gonna hit the ground. Can't happen. Can't kick out. Can't go sideways. Can't fall off. The only risk is going up and down, and if you have paired scaffold clips, you can obviate this risk as well.... Now, before you say "nobody has time for all that faff".... Well, maybe most don't, but I have done this very thing, repeatedly, for weeks last summer. 

 

 

[LeaLea910]

On 07/02/2022 at 21:11, Doug Tait said:

I carry Cellox Clotting Granules, Israeli Bandage, CAT Tourniquet and Whistle as a personal kit.

And hope that I'm able to use it if I have to.

 

Just as important as carrying the first aid stuff, for lone working, is your planning. Particularly having someone (with a copy of your risk assessment) that you will contact at agreed intervals and if you don't respond they have the relevant details ready to raise the alarm.

This is interesting, you are first people to mention having a 'check in buddy system' with! 
Thank you Doug, I wonder if all lone people use this system but it's just a given so they haven't mentioned it. Whistle, old school bit of kit, still as useful all of these years later... SHOULD you need it! (hopefully not!)

Thank you for your time in replying.