New echo chainsaw (USA)

[Piston Skirt]

5 hours ago, Stere said:

Iv'e often wondered about product range,  marketing price points, and manufacturing costs.

 

If say once the factoery production line is set up, the costs don't vary much betweeen making say a ms170 or 550xp so profit margin is alot higher on one than another?

 

MS170 and say MS 261 will differ in costs approximately 4 times.

First of all MS170 consists of around 180-190 parts total while 261 will be somewhere between 350-400. Part number alone makes the costs very different. Then, of course, the assembly procedures which are needed to get all this together.

Then there is the basic structure of the saw - MS170 has relatively simple steel conrod with pressed in roller cage bearings while MS 261 has a forged conrod with thermally treated ends and higher grade bearings in them.

Both crankshafts are essentially different - MS170 has a regular pressed 3 piece crank while MS261 has a 2 piece crank where the PTO side is way harder to produce in 1 piece with the crank pin...

Basically you can go through entire saw and most of the parts will differ like this, requiring additional operations and treatment which in turn consume energy and time which is not free :)

And then there is QC which also consists of procedures. I might be wrong but MS170 and MS261 most likely are treated differently at that stage too...

[Echo]

Yep, there is a lot to it, material type and grade used, tools required can differ,

more steps require more time, even using the mag piston, that takes less energy

to melt, and is quicker to get out of the molds than aluminium, its also easier on

the molds so they last longer, two items may look the same but be very different.

Edited February 18, 2021 by Echo

[Echo]

2 minutes ago, Echo said:

Yep, there is a lot to it, material type and grade used, tools required can differ,

more steps require more time, even using the mag piston, that takes less energy

to melt, and is quicker to get out of the molds than aluminium, so more can be made

in the same time, its also easier on the molds so they last longer, two items may look the same but be very different.

 

Edited February 18, 2021 by Echo

[Darkslider]

On 18/02/2021 at 18:14, Piston Skirt said:

 

MS170 and say MS 261 will differ in costs approximately 4 times.

First of all MS170 consists of around 180-190 parts total while 261 will be somewhere between 350-400. Part number alone makes the costs very different. Then, of course, the assembly procedures which are needed to get all this together.

Then there is the basic structure of the saw - MS170 has relatively simple steel conrod with pressed in roller cage bearings while MS 261 has a forged conrod with thermally treated ends and higher grade bearings in them.

Both crankshafts are essentially different - MS170 has a regular pressed 3 piece crank while MS261 has a 2 piece crank where the PTO side is way harder to produce in 1 piece with the crank pin...

Basically you can go through entire saw and most of the parts will differ like this, requiring additional operations and treatment which in turn consume energy and time which is not free

And then there is QC which also consists of procedures. I might be wrong but MS170 and MS261 most likely are treated differently at that stage too...

I've used and maintained a few ms170 and 180s, I'd say it's almost certain QC on the bottom of the range models is lacking. They made a big song and dance about how their Chinese factory where the entry level saws are made is to the same quality standard as anywhere else, but that's just not the case in my experience of the little homeowner saws.

[Wolfie]

Does anyone know if there is a design flaw in the 620sx oil pump.
Just about to replace mine for the second time in a fairly short period of time due to a worn flat spot on the gear.
Maybe I’ve got a dodgy worm
So I’m replacing that as well.

[Stubby]

7 hours ago, Wolfie said:

Maybe I’ve got a dodgy worm
 

I had a dodgy worm once , was on the can for days .

[Piston Skirt]

10 hours ago, Wolfie said:

Does anyone know if there is a design flaw in the 620sx oil pump.
Just about to replace mine for the second time in a fairly short period of time due to a worn flat spot on the gear.
Maybe I’ve got a dodgy worm
So I’m replacing that as well.

Nope. But they are likely to fail if the actual reason is still there. I’ve seen the metal strainers getting worn through and then letting metal particles go down to the pump. But it takes quite a long time in the forestry and total neglection.

[Stere]

New pro 40cc saws looks good.

 

 

 

[Paul in the woods]

Apart from a couple of cc what's the difference between the CS-4310SX and the CS-4510ES?

[Piston Skirt]

19 hours ago, Paul in the woods said:

Apart from a couple of cc what's the difference between the CS-4310SX and the CS-4510ES?

Everything. They aren’t even in the same class (pro saw vs plastic cased farmer saw).

4310 with 16”bar & chain weighs as much as 4510 naked powerhead.

I’m not even going into size/balance/maneuverability/acceleration.