Stoves and indoor pollution

[openspaceman]

It's easy enough to measure electricity usage but mains gas is probably a bit difficult to get accurate when measuring down to seconds. Maybe a propane hob and weighing the bottle before and after. I think I still have a tar boiler hob but no propane in a bottle small enough to go on my scales. Boiling water in a pan in consecutive tests should be good enough for most purposes.

 

Aside from convenience the overall efficiency of electricity would need to allow for the fuel used to generate it.

 

It's a moot point though because I can install a new electric induction hob myself but wouldn't attempt to do a gas one.

 

BTW as we have drifeted a bit from indoor pollution I do not think there would be significant difference between either type of cooking, gas or induction.

[Paddy1000111]

I think the only way to do a fair test would be an inline gas flow meter of some sort. 

 

You could say the same about gas though, drilling, extraction, purification, filtering, transport etc. It would be a massive variable depending on where your gas/electricity comes from. If you're powered by nuclear you could effectively say 0 but how far do you go back? Mining etc? What about all the machinery used in the process? No such thing as carbon neutral/negative in my eyes 😂

 

I was just looking at some articles saying about how gas hobs/ovens create an indoor atmosphere that's 5x dirtier than outdoor air. Electric is down to what you're accidently burning at the time. Next thing we will be measuring the toaster for particulate matter 😂😂

[openspaceman]

16 minutes ago, Paddy1000111 said:

 

It would also be interesting to read the PPM/CO2/CO etc from a new and used cooker in a kitchen with an extraction fan. One in good nick seems to put out 5-15ppm but a poor condition one seems to be about 30. Would be interested to compare that to testing the room when opening the fire door slowly and chucking a log or two in. 

This is a problem here as the kitchen is 3 rooms away from my wood stove and I only have the aforementioned induction hob and a traditional 4 hob ceramic one.

 

As an illustration I have just run the particulate sensor. The wood stove has been running all day and the sensor is desk level and 3metres away with my desk and monitor shading it from a direct line. The fire is flaming but dying down to a char bed and I slowly opened the door at 22:16:37 for about 2 seconds.

 

Data below the chart, PM2.5 are a subset of PM10, Some of the peaks are likely from my movement disturbing dust.

 

 
13 Jan 2021 22:15:17.552468: PM 2.5: 4.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:22.541711: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:27.541308: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:32.541301: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:37.541816: PM 2.5: 3.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:42.542274: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:47.542642: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:52.542770: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:57.543113: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.7 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:02.543387: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:07.543878: PM 2.5: 4.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:12.543252: PM 2.5: 4.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:17.542727: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:22.542117: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:27.540857: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:32.539946: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.7 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:37.538792: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:42.537891: PM 2.5: 4.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:47.537281: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:52.536628: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.3 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:57.535451: PM 2.5: 4.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:02.534932: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:07.534247: PM 2.5: 4.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.3 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:12.533532: PM 2.5: 4.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:17.532911: PM 2.5: 4.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:22.532304: PM 2.5: 5.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:27.531290: PM 2.5: 5.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:32.530590: PM 2.5: 5.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:37.530161: PM 2.5: 5.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:42.529265: PM 2.5: 5.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:47.528294: PM 2.5: 5.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:52.527633: PM 2.5: 4.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:57.527132: PM 2.5: 4.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:02.526742: PM 2.5: 4.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.7 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:07.526140: PM 2.5: 4.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:12.525617: PM 2.5: 4.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:17.525146: PM 2.5: 4.6 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:22.524442: PM 2.5: 4.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:27.523798: PM 2.5: 4.6 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:32.523459: PM 2.5: 4.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:37.522942: PM 2.5: 5.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 11.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:42.522294: PM 2.5: 5.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 12.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:47.522225: PM 2.5: 5.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 14.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:52.521869: PM 2.5: 5.3 μg/m^3  PM 10: 15.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:57.521474: PM 2.5: 5.3 μg/m^3  PM 10: 14.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:02.520996: PM 2.5: 5.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 14.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:07.520641: PM 2.5: 4.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 11.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:12.520491: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 10.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:17.520394: PM 2.5: 4.6 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:22.519902: PM 2.5: 4.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:27.519104: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:32.518735: PM 2.5: 4.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:37.518320: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:42.518397: PM 2.5: 4.6 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:47.518211: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:52.518158: PM 2.5: 4.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:57.518037: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:02.517714: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:07.518004: PM 2.5: 4.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:12.517864: PM 2.5: 4.3 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:17.517889: PM 2.5: 4.3 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:22.518098: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:27.517931: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:32.517713: PM 2.5: 4.3 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:37.517106: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:42.516917: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:47.516843: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:52.516823: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:57.516973: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:02.517065: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:07.517019: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:12.516910: PM 2.5: 3.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.7 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:17.516932: PM 2.5: 3.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:22.516785: PM 2.5: 3.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:27.516626: PM 2.5: 3.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:32.516657: PM 2.5: 3.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:37.516845: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:42.517175: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:47.517153: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:52.517234: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:57.517168: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:22:02.517254: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:22:07.517037: PM 2.5: 3.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.6 μg/m^3

 

 

 

[Squaredy]

6 minutes ago, openspaceman said:

This is a problem here as the kitchen is 3 rooms away from my wood stove and I only have the aforementioned induction hob and a traditional 4 hob ceramic one.

 

As an illustration I have just run the particulate sensor. The wood stove has been running all day and the sensor is desk level and 3metres away with my desk and monitor shading it from a direct line. The fire is flaming but dying down to a char bed and I slowly opened the door at 22:16:37 for about 2 seconds.

 

Data below the chart, PM2.5 are a subset of PM10, Some of the peaks are likely from my movement disturbing dust.

 

 
13 Jan 2021 22:15:17.552468: PM 2.5: 4.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:22.541711: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:27.541308: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:32.541301: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:37.541816: PM 2.5: 3.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:42.542274: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:47.542642: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:52.542770: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:57.543113: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.7 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:02.543387: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:07.543878: PM 2.5: 4.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:12.543252: PM 2.5: 4.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:17.542727: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:22.542117: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:27.540857: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:32.539946: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.7 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:37.538792: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:42.537891: PM 2.5: 4.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:47.537281: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:52.536628: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.3 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:57.535451: PM 2.5: 4.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:02.534932: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:07.534247: PM 2.5: 4.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.3 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:12.533532: PM 2.5: 4.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:17.532911: PM 2.5: 4.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:22.532304: PM 2.5: 5.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:27.531290: PM 2.5: 5.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:32.530590: PM 2.5: 5.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:37.530161: PM 2.5: 5.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:42.529265: PM 2.5: 5.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:47.528294: PM 2.5: 5.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:52.527633: PM 2.5: 4.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:57.527132: PM 2.5: 4.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:02.526742: PM 2.5: 4.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.7 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:07.526140: PM 2.5: 4.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:12.525617: PM 2.5: 4.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:17.525146: PM 2.5: 4.6 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:22.524442: PM 2.5: 4.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:27.523798: PM 2.5: 4.6 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:32.523459: PM 2.5: 4.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:37.522942: PM 2.5: 5.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 11.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:42.522294: PM 2.5: 5.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 12.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:47.522225: PM 2.5: 5.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 14.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:52.521869: PM 2.5: 5.3 μg/m^3  PM 10: 15.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:57.521474: PM 2.5: 5.3 μg/m^3  PM 10: 14.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:02.520996: PM 2.5: 5.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 14.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:07.520641: PM 2.5: 4.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 11.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:12.520491: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 10.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:17.520394: PM 2.5: 4.6 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:22.519902: PM 2.5: 4.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:27.519104: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:32.518735: PM 2.5: 4.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:37.518320: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:42.518397: PM 2.5: 4.6 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:47.518211: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:52.518158: PM 2.5: 4.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:57.518037: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:02.517714: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:07.518004: PM 2.5: 4.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:12.517864: PM 2.5: 4.3 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:17.517889: PM 2.5: 4.3 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:22.518098: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:27.517931: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:32.517713: PM 2.5: 4.3 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:37.517106: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:42.516917: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:47.516843: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:52.516823: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:57.516973: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:02.517065: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:07.517019: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:12.516910: PM 2.5: 3.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.7 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:17.516932: PM 2.5: 3.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:22.516785: PM 2.5: 3.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:27.516626: PM 2.5: 3.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:32.516657: PM 2.5: 3.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:37.516845: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:42.517175: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:47.517153: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:52.517234: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:57.517168: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:22:02.517254: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:22:07.517037: PM 2.5: 3.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.6 μg/m^3

 

 

 

I think I understand what your data shows, but can you comment on it for me in case I am mis-understanding?

[Paddy1000111]

3 minutes ago, openspaceman said:

This is a problem here as the kitchen is 3 rooms away from my wood stove and I only have the aforementioned induction hob and a traditional 4 hob ceramic one.

 

As an illustration I have just run the particulate sensor. The wood stove has been running all day and the sensor is desk level and 3metres away with my desk and monitor shading it from a direct line. The fire is flaming but dying down to a char bed and I slowly opened the door at 22:16:37 for about 2 seconds.

 

Data below the chart, PM2.5 are a subset of PM10, Some of the peaks are likely from my movement disturbing dust.

 

 
13 Jan 2021 22:15:17.552468: PM 2.5: 4.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:22.541711: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:27.541308: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:32.541301: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:37.541816: PM 2.5: 3.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:42.542274: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:47.542642: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:52.542770: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:15:57.543113: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.7 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:02.543387: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:07.543878: PM 2.5: 4.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:12.543252: PM 2.5: 4.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:17.542727: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:22.542117: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:27.540857: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:32.539946: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.7 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:37.538792: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:42.537891: PM 2.5: 4.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:47.537281: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:52.536628: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.3 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:16:57.535451: PM 2.5: 4.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:02.534932: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:07.534247: PM 2.5: 4.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.3 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:12.533532: PM 2.5: 4.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:17.532911: PM 2.5: 4.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:22.532304: PM 2.5: 5.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:27.531290: PM 2.5: 5.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:32.530590: PM 2.5: 5.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:37.530161: PM 2.5: 5.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:42.529265: PM 2.5: 5.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:47.528294: PM 2.5: 5.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:52.527633: PM 2.5: 4.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:17:57.527132: PM 2.5: 4.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:02.526742: PM 2.5: 4.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.7 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:07.526140: PM 2.5: 4.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:12.525617: PM 2.5: 4.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:17.525146: PM 2.5: 4.6 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:22.524442: PM 2.5: 4.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:27.523798: PM 2.5: 4.6 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:32.523459: PM 2.5: 4.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:37.522942: PM 2.5: 5.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 11.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:42.522294: PM 2.5: 5.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 12.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:47.522225: PM 2.5: 5.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 14.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:52.521869: PM 2.5: 5.3 μg/m^3  PM 10: 15.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:18:57.521474: PM 2.5: 5.3 μg/m^3  PM 10: 14.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:02.520996: PM 2.5: 5.0 μg/m^3  PM 10: 14.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:07.520641: PM 2.5: 4.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 11.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:12.520491: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 10.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:17.520394: PM 2.5: 4.6 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:22.519902: PM 2.5: 4.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:27.519104: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:32.518735: PM 2.5: 4.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:37.518320: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:42.518397: PM 2.5: 4.6 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:47.518211: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:52.518158: PM 2.5: 4.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:19:57.518037: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:02.517714: PM 2.5: 4.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:07.518004: PM 2.5: 4.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:12.517864: PM 2.5: 4.3 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:17.517889: PM 2.5: 4.3 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:22.518098: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:27.517931: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 9.0 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:32.517713: PM 2.5: 4.3 μg/m^3  PM 10: 8.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:37.517106: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:42.516917: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 7.1 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:47.516843: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:52.516823: PM 2.5: 4.2 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:20:57.516973: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:02.517065: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:07.517019: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.9 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:12.516910: PM 2.5: 3.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.7 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:17.516932: PM 2.5: 3.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.5 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:22.516785: PM 2.5: 3.4 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:27.516626: PM 2.5: 3.5 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:32.516657: PM 2.5: 3.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.2 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:37.516845: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:42.517175: PM 2.5: 3.9 μg/m^3  PM 10: 4.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:47.517153: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.4 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:52.517234: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:21:57.517168: PM 2.5: 4.1 μg/m^3  PM 10: 6.6 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:22:02.517254: PM 2.5: 3.8 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.8 μg/m^3
13 Jan 2021 22:22:07.517037: PM 2.5: 3.7 μg/m^3  PM 10: 5.6 μg/m^3

 

 

 

Interesting data! I don't know a tonne about particulate levels but looking at my air quality map from windy my local PM2.5 (the most damaging?) is 3.8-4 currently (maxed at 30) compared to London which is 19 but maxed at 80!!! earlier today.

My local PM10 is currently 10 but maxed at 22 during rush hour compared to London which is currently 17 and maxed at 33 during rush hour. 

 

I guess your air quality in your house is better than outdoors. With your fire open you're still lower than being outside in London... 

[Paddy1000111]

Not saying shangai is bad for pm2.5 right now but that looks like they're breathing sand... 😂

[openspaceman]

5 minutes ago, Squaredy said:

I think I understand what your data shows, but can you comment on it for me in case I am mis-understanding?

@Squaredy there are so many variables and I am probably not qualified to discriminate signal from noise.

 

The "dangerous" particles are probably the 2.5 micron down to 1.5 micron, these are the ones that once in your lungs can get into the cells and blood, most will be exhaled. Most PM10 are trapped in mucous or nasal hairs  and eventually swallowed harmlessly.

 

Then there are different chemicals, ash is probably less dangerous than smoke.

 

In my graph the medium  peak at 22:17:02 is probably smoke reaching the sensor 30 seconds after I opened the door  The other peaks are probably my movement as I left the room for a call of nature a few seconds after I started the experiment and closed the door. This is probably why the big peak is mostly bigger particles of ash dust but I am open to other interpretations.

[openspaceman]

11 hours ago, Paddy1000111 said:

 

I guess your air quality in your house is better than outdoors. With your fire open you're still lower than being outside in London... 

Probably but as I said in a post a few days back the outside air particulate level  rises during the evening possibly because quite a few neighbours have wood stoves for effect.

 

I really need to keep one sensor running all day inside and one out but I haven't managed to learn enough Python to write a measurement to file every 15 seconds for 24 hours.

 

I would also like to put one sensor the other side of the holly hedge 5metres in front of the house and 4 metres from the road, which is a thoroughfare with a car every few minutes this late at night and delivery vans and buses much more frequently during the day.

 

I don't feel my indoor air quality is a worry but it would be interesting to sense in an all electric house.

Edited January 14, 2021 by openspaceman
major mistake saying air quality rose during the evening when I meant the opposite, particulate levels rose

[Paddy1000111]

20 minutes ago, openspaceman said:

Probably but as I said in a post a few days back the outside air quality rises during the evening possibly because quite a few neighbours have wood stoves for effect.

Probably that plus the drop in air temperature bringing particulate matter that's risen in the day to drop maybe?

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

29 minutes ago, openspaceman said:

Probably but as I said in a post a few days back the outside air quality rises during the evening possibly because quite a few neighbours have wood stoves for effect.

 

I really need to keep one sensor running all day inside and one out but I haven't managed to learn enough Python to write a measurement to file every 15 seconds for 24 hours.

 

I would also like to put one sensor the other side of the holly hedge 5metres in front of the house and 4 metres from the road, which is a thoroughfare with a car every few minutes this late at night and delivery vans and buses much more frequently during the day.

 

I don't feel my indoor air quality is a worry but it would be interesting to sense in an all electric house.

Bit off topic but there was an interesting caller to Ian Dale show earlier on LBC. 
 

He was a laid off commercial aircon engineer. As he told it, bored with no work on and ‘troubled’ by the reports of supermarkets being super conductors of C19, and ‘people’ not adhering to preventative measures, he decided to take his air quality monitoring equipment to the supermarket. 
 

What he said he found after measurements in various big name stores was that all bar 1 was wildly off what the government (?) air quality / moisture levels ‘should’ be. Apparently, such standards are published and available online (?)

 

I found it interesting (whilst having no idea if he was talking bullox or not) because (a) who even knew supermarket air quality was a ‘thing’ and (b) if it is, maybe the whole approach to C19 preventative measures is being mis sold as individual responsibility whereas corporate responsibility may be slipping the leash?

 

Apol’s for going off piste but thought you might be interested or have a view on it 🧐