Our industry

[Lee Winger]

When I think about it, on the whole I think I'm appreciated, but then I jacked all the sorry penny pinching sado barstewards in years ago!

 

I've actually been very appreciated on construction sites.............

[skyhuck]

This is such an interesting thread.

 

I really don't get any feeling of being looked down on in any way.

 

If anything I have been amazed at the amount of respect and admiration I have received over the years.

 

Maybe its because I came into the industry from the very bottom, with no expectations.

 

I have never been to college, I learnt on the job or taught my self.

 

People often praise our work and I earn far more than I ever dreamt I would.

Edited December 30, 2009 by skyhuck

[Andy Clark]

Something that i'd like to throw into the mix about now, and expanding on Tonys original side A or side B synopsis....... how do people feel about the industry from a "direction" perspective?

 

 

Are we happy with what it has become, over the past 20+ years??

 

Are we happy with what it is likely to become, over the next 20+ years??

[Lee Winger]

Something that i'd like to throw into the mix about now, and expanding on Tonys original side A or side B synopsis....... how do people feel about the industry from a "direction" perspective?

 

 

Are we happy with what it has become, over the past 20+ years??

 

 

 

I'm afraid American forums have made me feel rather bitter about the industry here in the UK, we seem stuck in the mud, we are nowhere near as professional as our American chums

[Dean Lofthouse]

we are nowhere near as professional as our American chums

 

I find that a little bit insulting really Lee...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think you should apologise forthwith to the Americans

[Mesterh]

Are we happy with what it has become, over the past 20+ years??

 

I dont think things have really changed at all over the last 20 years, well last 14/15 years that ive been in it anyway.

 

Probably more people have heard of a 'tree surgeon' or at least know what one is.

 

Always get customers saying things like " I didnt realise you needed so much equipment" " Didnt know there was that much work involved" "didnt realise there would be that much stuff(ie brash timber)" etc etc.

 

I do still think that us tree people are still mainly seen as gardeners with chainsaws (btw I aint taking anything away from gardeners its just a different job) its just that they dont realise why it should cost soo much to get a tree pruned/felled etc. Plus loads think I make a fortune selling firewood and woodchip:001_smile:

 

I think that in my neck of the woods most see trees as an expensive burden, that also includes the LA's too!

[Amelanchier]

Ecology is seen by goverment & client as a sustainable interface, whereas the majority of Tree work alas is not.

This must lead to the general impression that the industry is mostly driven by the coin and not the needs of end user, that being the conection and access that society reqiures to it's assets.

 

I think the sustainability agenda is something we should be a big part of but like you say, the ecologists have it in the bag. Perhaps the impact of european direction bolsters their status? perhaps we're a one trick pony?

 

Maybe we're seen also as a reactive industry - the people who you call when stuff goes wrong or gets dangerous? Not the people you call when you want proactive design or management?

 

Farm stewardships involve tree management and planting but ignore arbs. Most planning design involving trees is done by landscapers (most of it poorly IMO). Perhaps these and other people do the job sufficiently well?

[Amelanchier]

Something that i'd like to throw into the mix about now, and expanding on Tonys original side A or side B synopsis....... how do people feel about the industry from a "direction" perspective?

 

 

Are we happy with what it has become, over the past 20+ years??

 

Are we happy with what it is likely to become, over the next 20+ years??

 

I think things have progressed fairly over the past 20 years. The basic research has been done - Shigo / Mattheck and the like, and its been implemented by the majority of 'proper' tree workers and enshrined in British Standards.

 

I suspect the next 20 years will be a bit of a let down compared with that. We should aim for integration not specialisation. That's why I mentioned the FC - hell as far as the lawmakers are concerned, urban trees are their remit anyway. We're nothing but a minority pressure group. Perhaps we should aim for reformation rather than revolution and push our agenda from inside the belly of the beast?

[Big 'Ammer]

I think the sustainability agenda is something we should be a big part of but like you say, the ecologists have it in the bag. Perhaps the impact of european direction bolsters their status? perhaps we're a one trick pony?

 

Maybe we're seen also as a reactive industry - the people who you call when stuff goes wrong or gets dangerous? Not the people you call when you want proactive design or management?

 

Farm stewardships involve tree management and planting but ignore arbs. Most planning design involving trees is done by landscapers (most of it poorly IMO). Perhaps these and other people do the job sufficiently well?

 

Only today,

 

three different farmers and landowners told me how they had thinned , managed and restocked woodlands, and planted new woods on agricultural land, this year, from their own pockets, as they didn't like the stringent and inflexible nature of the grant schemes.

 

This has cost all three small farmers thousands £££.

 

None expect to see any financial return on the work in future years, but they will get the landscape how they want it, for shooting, and the greater benefit of wildlife and amenity use.

 

Doesn't this in some way mirror how Joe Public wants his garden?

 

Same thing on a larger scale.

 

He who pays the piper calls the tune.

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

I like to consider myself in both camps Tony. I don't love trees enough to get bogged down by the science and bilogy side of things but I also don't love money anywhere near enough for that to be the motivating factor.

 

Its work, and its outside and its involves climbing/logic/planning and a nerdy desire to collect shiny gadgets.

 

I like doing nice work to nice trees, but bad tree work is still tree management and "trees" in general don't suffer from individual cases of bad work and many thrive after poor decisions have been made in the past.

 

So as far as our industry is concerned, yes I think we have a way over inflated sense of our own importance, they are only trees and we are only service providers.

 

I have done some research as to what the client expectations were prior to engaging a contractor. The answers seem consistanlty to suggest the most clients expect some halfwit inbred with fingers missing or a beardy weardy to turn up three days late, if at all, and do some grunting before leaving them with a quote written in crayon on the back of a rizzla packet.

 

Many clients just don't believe that relatively educated and presentable humans would be doing such a job, and so their expectations are so low that in many cases they accept un-insured bodgers (or boskers) as being the norm, and just don't bother trying to find anybody better.

 

Until this image is changed we will forever fight this battle, but for many its not worth it and I personally look toward commercial contracts where a level of proffessionalism is required/expected, then all I need to do is deliver instead of havign to try and educate each individual that wants there one and only self seeded sycamore reduced by 50% because it blocks direct light for the one day of the year they want to use the garden.

 

Well said that man!