Sub contractor but also team leader

[eggsarascal]

9 minutes ago, Ratman said:

Any insurance company will gladly take your money on pretty much any scenario, but like mark suggested earlier, would they stand by you if it came to ehh lads ehh! If working alone for yourself you should really have EL regardless. Working alone for someone else, i.e being the subbie, you should really still have your own EL as you have advertised as a lone/self employed worker for them to hire you in the first place, but the liabilities would then be and stay with them as you are doing the works for them.

 

 

Nonsense.

[Steve Bullman]

19 minutes ago, Ratman said:

Any insurance company will gladly take your money on pretty much any scenario, but like mark suggested earlier, would they stand by you if it came to ehh lads ehh! If working alone for yourself you should really have EL regardless. Working alone for someone else, i.e being the subbie, you should really still have your own EL as you have advertised as a lone/self employed worker for them to hire you in the first place, but the liabilities would then be and stay with them as you are doing the works for them.

 

 

Eh?

[Ratman]

Eggs / Steve, its not law to have EL or PL insurance when self employed, but is a huge safety net. Ultimately the book stops with the person / company that has hired you.

Reference above post, sorry was referring to PL for you Eggs, EL would be for the company you were subbing too. Words in a mucking fuddle.

 

[eggsarascal]

9 minutes ago, Ratman said:

Eggs / Steve, its not law to have EL or PL insurance when self employed, but is a huge safety net. Ultimately the book stops with the person / company that has hired you.

I thought having EL Is a legal obligation if you employ one or more people.

Edited April 3, 2019 by eggsarascal

[Ratman]

I thought having EL Is a legal obligation. 

For an employee it is law, for employing anyone part time or more, for employing one person and more. You personally would / should only require PL, its not law for you though, but advisable.

 

[Ratman]

There are EL exemptions where its not required by law but gets messy depending on the situation like working abroad for instance. I know brief bits about it cos a bloke that used to do site work and training at our place got landed in a spot of bother with it all, no expert tho.

 

 

[monkeybusiness]

Surely you only need employers liability if you are the actual employer (ie the person/business paying someone to work)?

Just because an individual may be operating as a team leader giving instruction to others (howsoever employed) cannot possibly mean that they have to carry separate EL cover. 

If a subby works for me (not in a bona fide capacity) and damages something, whether they hold insurance or not is irrelevant as the PL claim would be against me/my business. I can’t see how there is a difference with EL. 

[Rough Hewn]

My PL and EL is about £1000 a year. Can have up to 5 bods on site.
With arborisk.
As pertaining to the OP,
The difference between "main contractor", bonafide sub contractor and true subby is very grey.
Personally I would phone hmrc and have a chat,
Then send them a letter in writing to confirm the details of the phone calls results.
[emoji106]

[Mesterh]

This should be easy to answer. If I use a bona fide subby and send one of my employee's to work under his instructions who is then injured due to the actions/instructions of said subby will my emoyers liability pay out? If NO then that is a major problem.

 

Also is there a possibility that my EL insurance might pay out depending on the level of cover etc. If the answer is YES then that should be something which is clear in the EL document so the subby can easily check.

 

It should not be a grey area as the important thing is the injured employee should be covered no matter what happens to them.

 

Will any of the insurance companies confirm the above please? 

[Tree Surgeon Insurance]

The question here is are they a bona fide subby? It is pretty much impossible for a climber or groundsman on day rate to be a bona fide subby, so the law would see them both as employees. Maybe in a different scenario such as having somebody in with a JCB it could be different. You should be very careful about mixing bona fide subbies and labour only subbies.  You are required by law to display your EL certificate and then if a bona fide subby is in a position to see it,  an assumption could be made.... and yes this does happen.  As always whether customers of ours or not you are free too call for further advice. Tree Surgeon Insurance 01732 373864