Johnnyboxer

Especially when the Law is unclear or those employed to enforce aren't sure of the specifics of the law that they are trying to enforce Amen

Limited to half a page and doesn't yield much info:001_tt2:

Well, after 35 years of solely driving manuals and never driven an Auto................I have now purchased an Auto So...............how do you drive them? It's a new 3.0 Hilux Invincible, so not that sophisticated with Tiptronic/Steptronic/DSG and all that malarkey It's a 5 speed box, as pictured below Naturally it has D for Drive and R for Reverse and P for Park Yep, yep all that is fairly simple But it also has numbers ~ 2/3/4 and a L for Low (presumably 1st) What do these numbers mean? I find that in town in 20's/30's/40' it's very easy to be in too high a gear in D mode and for it to 'run-on' - so you tend to exceed the posted speed limits in built up areas Can I go from D to 4 to 3, by knocking the lever into those positions whilst in town and then back up to D (via 3>4>D), once back out on the open NSL roads or Dual Carriageways If I do that, will it damage the autobox to switch between D and the numbers? Or is it ok to do that? Only talking about 2000rpm, as the motor has bags of torque around town Yours in hope................. for an Auto numpty

Definitely a speed camera - it's like a Police anti-speed state up here in North Yorkshire with 12-16 Camera Vans and 4 Police Bikes, with tripod mounted digital speed cameras

Don't think so, as Ford do a specific Fiesta platform Van Ford Connect has no car equivalent VW say Caddy is a commercial and is same size as Connect

Oh well, looks like I will be testing the theories about speed limits now Last night at 6.30pm (dusk fast approaching) I passed a digital speed camera - tripod mounted & in a field gateway with a police operator A ROAD and I was doing an indicated 60mph or thereabouts on the speedo, or a smidgen less - so with a 10% calibration reduction tolerance we will see what the postman brings A Transit Connect was overtaking me as I passed the speed camera operator which was an interesting conundrum - no doubt he'll get done as he should have been doing 50mph Hilux Invincible 3.0l Auto & no canopy EU classification stated MASS in Service on v5c is 2055kg Kerb Weight, stated by Toyota is 2030 kg Unladen weight will be well below the 2040kg DVLA & VOSA ...,DPV ruling The next 14 days ......place your bets gentlemen

Have you got to the bottom of it ?

Just got a copy of my v5c, for my new 3litre Invincible Auto and the Mass in Service figure is 2055kg So the Unladen Weight will be.... 2055kg minus driver and tools at 75kg, minus 90% of fuel 72kg, Oil 5kg, Water 5kg and that Unladen Weight comes in at approx 1898kg Toyota Claim Kerb Weight at 2030kg for the Vehicle (Fuel/Oil/Water) but no driver So this is all well within the DPV Unladen Weight of a max of 2040kg So I'm happy for 60/70/70 speed limits Interestingly Taxation Class is Light Goods Vehicle and Body Type Light 4x4 Utility and Vehicle Category is N1 (Light Goods up to 3500kg)

The driver weight is the difference:thumbup1: It's the confusion between UK and EEC law directives on weights We have UK C&U definitions for a DPV and then the EEC comes in and confuses it, with Mass in Service Soon we will wave goodbye to EU definitions

Found this Mass in service is defined under The European Directive 95/48/EC which includes 90% fuel and 75kg for driver and tools. As it is an EU wide directive one must assume the DVLA use the same definition shown on the V5. It is generally assumed by most that kerb weight is the same

Indeed I'm taking it as the Manufacturer's stated Kerb Weight, which is what they will declare for EEC Type approval and this is what DVLA will recognise when they class it as a DPV Subtract the fuel/oil and water load at c.80kg and you'll get an Unladen Weight - but I bet DVLA will just use the Kerb Weight and whether it is over or under 2040kgs for D/Cab Pickups If you get pinged at 60mph on an A road, the Police Camera will link back to the original DVLA DPV classification at date of 1st reg, so no fine will be issued Whether you've stuck a towbar,canopy or 100kgs of saws/rigging on the bed is of no consequence as it will be linked to the original stated weight declared by the manufacturer's data for a bare pickup and they won't take you to a weighbridge Post sale, what you do with it in terms of accessories is of no concern, unless you are stopped by VOSA and exceed the vehicles maximum gross weight, all up The Invincible 3l Auto, I'm getting next month is declared with a Kerb Weight of 2030kg, so well within the DPV limit of an Unladen Weight of no more than 2040kgs

Obviously:thumbup1:

So it's 60/70/70 if it meets the criteria for a DPV https://www.gov.uk/speed-limits

Link to Thames Valley Police Thames Valley Police - Frequently asked questions - Answer

Dept of Transport Dual Purpose Vehicle definition Dual purpose vehicles A dual purpose vehicle is a vehicle constructed or adapted for the carriage both of passengers and of goods and designed to weigh no more than 2,040 kg when unladen, and is either: constructed or adapted so that the driving power of the engine is, or can be selected to be, transmitted to all wheels of the vehicle or permanently fitted with a rigid roof, at least one row of transverse passenger seats to the rear of the driver’s seat and will have side and rear windows - there must also be a minimum ratio between the size of passenger and stowage areas See The Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986 (Part 1 Regulation 3) for the full definition.

Construction & Use definition of a Dual Purpose Vehicle dual-purpose vehicle a vehicle constructed or adapted for the carriage both of passengers and of goods or burden of any description, being a vehicle of which the unladen weight does not exceed 2040 kg, and which either— (i)is so constructed or adapted that the driving power of the engine is, or by the appropriate use of the controls of the vehicle can be, transmitted to all the wheels of the vehicle; or (ii)satisfies the following conditions as to construction, namely— (a)the vehicle must be permanently fitted with a rigid roof, with or without a sliding panel; (b)the area of the vehicle to the rear of the driver's seat must— (i)be permanently fitted with at least one row of transverse seats (fixed or folding) for two or more passengers and those seats must be properly sprung or cushioned and provided with upholstered back-rests, attached either to the seats or to a side or the floor of the vehicle; and (ii)be lit on each side and at the rear by a window or windows of glass or other transparent material having an area or aggregate area of not less than 1850 square centimetres on each side and not less than 770 square centimetres at the rear; and ©the distance between the rearmost part of the steering wheel and the back-rests of the row of transverse seats satisfying the requirements specified in head (i) of sub-paragraph (b) (or, if there is more than one such row of seats, the distance between the rearmost part of the steering wheel and the back-rests of the rearmost such row) must, when the seats are ready for use, be not less than one-third of the distance between the rearmost part of the steering wheel and the rearmost part of the floor of the vehicle.

I checked the brochures, for old and new Hilux and the Kerb Weight is stated at 2030kg for the old 3.0l Invincible, so take off 72kg (90% of 80l tank) and say 5kg for other oils and fluids, then the unladen weight falls well within the 2040kg weight ruling for a DPV Therefore it's ok to do 60/70/70 same as a car It seems that the new post 2016 Hilux Invincible has grown some unladen and kerb weight and now doesn't meet the criteria for a DPV in UK anymore - but overall Toyota sell worldwide and can't meet every individual speed limit criteria DVLA will categorise the DPV type classification on the original manufacturer's stated weight, for a bare new pick up and what you load or attach, post sale will not affect the speed limit attached to the vehicle, at type approval Luckily I have bought the old model Invincible - delivery miles & pre reg and collect 1st Oct as I didn't fancy Add-Bloo or the 2.4 engine and this overweight conundrum just adds to the that, if you're limited to 50/60/70 speed limits and potentially Class7 MOT etc in future

Pre 2016 Hilux Invincibles all stated a kerb weight of less than 2040kg, so it is classed as a DPV (meets the 4WD,seating and cab glass requirements) the heaviest being the 3.0l Invincible Auto, just gliding in at 2030kg as the heaviest I guess the new model Hilux are now heavier at over 2100kg and thus fall foul of existing DPV weight criteria

First auto for me too, so that's good to hear Not many of the old models left so it's Hobson's choice I think it's one of the last in uk dealers Metallic, auto Invincible 3 miles on clock and pre reg - will be 3 months old when released for £19k + Vat when the new model Hilux Invincible auto is well over £25-£26k + Vat

Invincible 5 on the MY 2012-2016 (which I am buying) & same as the manuals 6 on the new MY16 onwards

Toyota claim 38mpg if you drive like a nun at 56 mph Does fitting a canopy create less drag - increasing mpg or is there no difference ?

Anyone tell me if they're any good ? Found a 16 pre-reg one with 3 miles on it at a cracking price - last of old model Just for general business use, not much towing Is the auto nice to drive I know mpg might be lumpy, so may get it chipped with a Tuneit or Steinbauer Need to swap to a commercial & don't fancy a van for work

Thanks Just bought one of the last 7th gen 2016's Pick it up 1st Oct

Still happy with it?

2 years, he said