Tree work in close proximity to railway lines and platform

[drinksloe]

I'm no legal eagle and others on here could mibee take this idea further.

 

But if they are cutting the branches at the lower level at there own expense surely they have set a precedent so should pay for the cutting on their side right to the top.

Then u just have to negotiate them taking the tops off the trees

 

Not the type of job u could knock off on a sunday morning either without being seen

[Joel77]

this job does need safety critical staff on the platform but just one coss and only when your facing up the trees all staff on the platform need track certs BTA

 

I'd reduse them fist and pull them over in your garden then hire a coss for just the days your working on the platform 1 or 2 shifts depending on window of time, the area needs barriers and signs and can be done at night to avoid any disruption to the service

 

I don't see this as a bad job it's pritty straght forward

[IVECOKID]

I'm not sure TBH, would have to do a bit of research. If they were, would that mean that it would be NR's responsibility to remove them, even though they are in my garden? Wouldn't they claim something like "well you bought the house knowing about the trees, so they are your responsibility" (as I've heard before)?

 

I say this because my friend had a similar scenario has you in a old Staion house except these were on the main Liverpool lime street line to Crewe ! Made those conies of yours look like Tulips lol , they came out and took the top off them, its there responsibility if they over hanging has thy should of maintained there side being a platform.

I would push forward with solicitors.

 

 

Ste

Edited June 8, 2016 by IVECOKID

[Homegrown]

I await the results of your investigations with baited breath

 

A quick look suggests it derives from four railway acts that make it a criminal offence to trespass or endanger the railway infrastructure. So given the above no unauthorised work may be done on the railway infrastructure, any authorised work is done under the auspices of the Office of Road And Rail which manage the safety on the railway and oversee the required competencies.

 

From the pictures the job is an urban station in Kent Surrey Hampshire or Sussex or possibly one line in Dorset or Liverpool. The train frequency could be less than 30 minutes on each line so line blocks are unlikely, It looks probable it's what used to be called red zone working so a possession is the best time.

 

The local management delivery unit would have to be involved but as has been said the clearing up can take place after the at risk job has finished.

 

You can take a horse to water...

[peatff]

I watched a couple of young lads taking some Leylandii down a few months back. They were next to a brook not overhanging a railway platform and one climbed and reduced them while the other fed into the chipper and it was a very messy job, not that they were doing a bad job but the trees had multitudes of trunk like branches growing upwards from the bottom and there was a lot of dead stuff in the middle. I would take off what I could up to the height of the fence on your side then take a good look at what there is to work with.

[drinksloe]

I say this because my friend had a similar scenario has you in a old Staion house except these were on the main Liverpool lime street line to Crewe ! Made those conies of yours look like Tulips lol , they came out and took the top off them, its there responsibility if they over hanging has thy should of maintained there side being a platform.

I would push forward with solicitors.

 

 

Ste

 

I'm with iveco here, there is nothing to stop them cutting the tree back to boundry at there own expense, and the fact they have already done the easy bit at there expense possibly helps.

When i worked on railways climbed plenty of hardwoods in folks gardens far further off the track than that to take limbs of or side up whole tree and all at NR expense. But possibly things have changed or their chancing there luck.

 

If u can get NR to do there side i'd have a quiet word with the cutting crew that comes in or there gaffer/surveyor (almost certainly be subbies), not a big job to take tops off while they are there esp if got a cherry picker on site. and if u offered to take the chip/logs it would save them a lot off work otherwise would have to be dragged to end of platform to be chipped.

The time saved by putting chip on ur side instead of dragging would easy cover the time to knock tops off

 

 

Do u actually want the trees removed?

Once the trees are sided up u can have a look wot ur left with and make a more informed decsion. Probably would be benifical to top them atleast.

But it will be far easier on tree surgeon if all the wieght is off the far side.

U may even get away with doing any work without NR once they are sided up, or atleast be a far quickier job.

 

But i really would stand ur ground and refuse to pay for any work on the rail side.

(Does ur tree surgeon not know anyone doing rail work in the local area? who main contractor is or who subbies are?)

[Treewolf]

A quick look suggests it derives from four railway acts that make it a criminal offence to trespass or endanger the railway infrastructure. So given the above no unauthorised work may be done on the railway infrastructure, any authorised work is done under the auspices of the Office of Road And Rail which manage the safety on the railway and oversee the required competencies.

 

From the pictures the job is an urban station in Kent Surrey Hampshire or Sussex or possibly one line in Dorset or Liverpool. The train frequency could be less than 30 minutes on each line so line blocks are unlikely, It looks probable it's what used to be called red zone working so a possession is the best time.

 

The local management delivery unit would have to be involved but as has been said the clearing up can take place after the at risk job has finished.

 

You can take a horse to water...

 

Railway law is (of course) complex, but in general I believe that if you damage (or do something which risks damaging) trains or endanger the safety of rail users you face prosecution under the Criminal Damage Act 1971, the Offences Against the Person Act 1861, or the Malicious Damage Act 1861. If there is provable intent, the sentence can include life imprisonment. So by cutting those trees in a manner which potentially endangers passing trains, you could face charges even if you are unaware of the danger you are inadvertantly causing.

 

Offences involving trespass on railway property (which is unlikely to take place if you took them down from the garden side) is covered by the Railway Regulation Act 1840, the Regulation of the Railways Act 1868, and British Transport Commission Act 1949. Penalties are significantly less, eg 1 month's imprisonment and/or fines.

 

A risk assessment of the operation to remove/reduce these trees would in my opinion show that whilst the likelihood of a mishap causing danger to railway operations is small, the consequences are potentially catastrophic (multiple fatalities and millions in property damage if a passing train is derailed at speed).

 

Getting this one wrong could be a life-changing experience for the you as the property owner and for your contractor, and I commend you for coming on here to ask for advice. Personally I beleive that you must involve Network Rail and if possible persuade NR to remove the trees at their own expense. After all, they haven't produced any evidence that the trees are dangerous or a statutory nuisance, and it is they who want them gone, not you.

 

Good luck!

[Loler UK]

Hi where are you based? It might be an idea to speak to some link up approved contractors in your area, also have you spoken to the station operator?

You may find that with the involvement of one or the other or both you could come to a more affordable solution.

From the photos it appears perfectly achievable to remove the trees without a possession (closing a train line) and without requiring access via the platform but i would find it necessary to cordon off the platform which will require both network rail and station operator involvement.

A local link up contractor (approved to work on the rail) may be able to mediate with NR & the SO far more effectively than you.

 

Your other option would be to employ an Arboricultural consultant to mediate for you if they are asking you to remove or reduce them as they perceive them to pose an unacceptable level of hazard/ risk in their current form it may be that your consultant disagrees. I've dealt with some nasty 3rd party disputes over the years, usually working for network rail/ one of their contractors so i suppose i'm a little poacher turned gamekeeper. If you get to the point of disagreeing as to them requiring immediate removal/ reduction you may find them much more open to compromise regarding cost etc.

 

where are you based? i might be able to recommend a link up contractor in your area with experience in these matters, or a consultant with 3rd party tree railway dispute experience. If you seek your own consultant ensure that they have sufficient experience with railway disputes as many will not. Unfortunately either way id estimate you'll be looking at around £350 for an appraisal and some mediation/ co-ordination but this COULD save you allot in the long run

[graeme3000]

I would take off what I could up to the height of the fence on your side then take a good look at what there is to work with.

 

Thanks - my tree surgeon intends to do exactly that, but NR want me to enter into an agreement before they comment on whether this is acceptable or not. Personally, I can't see how it has anything to do with them because the work would be low risk and in my garden!

[graeme3000]

Railway law is (of course) complex, but in general I believe that if you damage (or do something which risks damaging) trains or endanger the safety of rail users you face prosecution under the Criminal Damage Act 1971, the Offences Against the Person Act 1861, or the Malicious Damage Act 1861. If there is provable intent, the sentence can include life imprisonment. So by cutting those trees in a manner which potentially endangers passing trains, you could face charges even if you are unaware of the danger you are inadvertantly causing.

 

Offences involving trespass on railway property (which is unlikely to take place if you took them down from the garden side) is covered by the Railway Regulation Act 1840, the Regulation of the Railways Act 1868, and British Transport Commission Act 1949. Penalties are significantly less, eg 1 month's imprisonment and/or fines.

 

A risk assessment of the operation to remove/reduce these trees would in my opinion show that whilst the likelihood of a mishap causing danger to railway operations is small, the consequences are potentially catastrophic (multiple fatalities and millions in property damage if a passing train is derailed at speed).

 

Getting this one wrong could be a life-changing experience for the you as the property owner and for your contractor, and I commend you for coming on here to ask for advice. Personally I beleive that you must involve Network Rail and if possible persuade NR to remove the trees at their own expense. After all, they haven't produced any evidence that the trees are dangerous or a statutory nuisance, and it is they who want them gone, not you.

 

Good luck!