LOLER Facts.

[Mesterh]

Well I sit corrected

Just have never heard climbing gear refered to as PPE.

 

So is rigging gear different in that it doesnt need an inspection from new since it wont have a cert of conformity?

[bob]

Ropes,krabs and harnesses are used in work positioning, therefore are PPE as protection from a fall from height.

 

not arguing just pointing an easier definition

what is PPE

Personal Protective Equipment

[Pete Mctree]

 

So is rigging gear different in that it doesnt need an inspection from new since it wont have a cert of conformity?

 

I don't quite understand what you are asking here, but I will try.

 

Firstly; all kit supplied should have a COC - which refers to which relevant standards it conforms or markings to the same effect.(although not all rigging kit seems too)

 

Secondly; kit supplied new should be fit for use from purchase (unless it is stated otherwise)

 

 

 

Hope that helps, however until I find the relevant facts to give you the definitive answer i'm not offering this as the complete answer (my head is in the books as i type)

[Arbocop]

Well I sit corrected

Just have never heard climbing gear refered to as PPE.

 

So is rigging gear different in that it doesnt need an inspection from new since it wont have a cert of conformity?

 

ohh this is a real tricky one and its getting late so i may do it in a few posts and try to be as acurate as possible

 

lets start with certs of conformity, this is truly a document created between the manfacturer and the notifying body ( the guys that do the CE marking) it sometimes relates to a EN number or some times a EU directive and confims conformity with that thing.

 

as a consumer we had very little right to a cert of conformity that is untill 2002 when ppe regs that relate to manufacturing spelt out that a ce mark placed on an item of ppe indicates conformity to the EC directive and specific requirments there under........ so thats fine is it not?????

 

alas no loler says 'if no cert of confmity then new kit must be insected befor firt use' so if we take this to the enth degree the ce mark that must be on ppe is not a cert so gear must be cheaked. i have a personal opinion about this but thats for another time i think..

 

so what is the issue with a cert of conformity, the main issue is that the certificate is truly issued from the notifying body to to company wishing ce aprovel, and we the consumer have no strict right to get it.

 

if we whant to get really anal about this those packing notes invoices etc that say cert of conformity strictly are not.... but for many satisfy the criteria, we even produce something similar through our outlets.

 

we could argue that the paperwork produce is notice of conformity, and thats fine by me.

 

i think in all of this what we need to do is be sensible, of far moor use than the cert of conformity is user instructions and care information, these really are vital, and many manufacturers are now putting conformity declarations in there instructions, in line with best practice for ppe, some are not and some times the paperwork just gets plain lost as some suppiers send it seperate to there gear.

 

but ask as well if you are buying gear form sme one they should be able to answer your questions, and help steer you, produce you some sort of notice and also user instructions. and give you good advice about what works well with what.

 

and finaly ive found many whole salers and manufacturers very very willing to help and fax stuff over or e mail infor to you if you ask.

 

does that help or just make things really muddy

 

cheers all

 

kev

[Arbocop]

pete its not just in the books its in the standards, the gudance the regs the acts the eu directives its a blooming nightmare, i train loler cources and we only ever touch on all this , im trying to sort it out for our retail side but you fall under differant regs for retail and use and well itss all very very complex and i spend my days asking, especially when you start getting in to the directives.

 

at the end of the day buy good gear from known place keep records

 

avoid cheap internet deals

 

kev

[Pete Mctree]

pete its not just in the books its in the standards, the gudance the regs the acts the eu directives its a blooming nightmare, i train loler cources and we only ever touch on all this , im trying to sort it out for our retail side but you fall under differant regs for retail and use and well itss all very very complex and i spend my days asking, especially when you start getting in to the directives.

 

at the end of the day buy good gear from known place keep records

 

avoid cheap internet deals

 

kev

 

Thanks for that Kev. I find the definitive answer very elusive on ocasions. I guess my further reading for the next couple of weeks aint gonna be my usual Mills & Boon

[Mesterh]

Cheers for the info fellas

 

Once again thanks Arbocop for taking time out to explain everything

 

I am trying to get my head around all of this its just that sometimes more information breeds more questions!

 

Sometimes I think I would be better off not knowing, or I would be better off working for someone else

[Arbocop]

your welcome guys

 

at the end of the day the thing in the primary regs that all forget is 'so far as resnobule practicable' and the hse do always measure 'over and ubove'

 

i can quote stuff till im blue in the face but at the end of the day its all about going home safe.

[DriveLink]

When a product falls under the scope of a 'New Approach Directive' (which PPE does), it must comply with the requirements of the relevant directives to be CE marked. For PPE this directive is, I believe, 89/686/EEC. A product that conforms to the 'New Approach Directive' is shown to do so through the Certificate Of Conformity (and it goes through a conformity assessment process to do so).

 

Now I get confused, as there's also a Declaration Of Conformity where manufacturers operating in the EU have to demonstrate that a product complies with H&S requirements of the relevant directives, but... and this is the bit that I don't get... this shows conformity to the European Directive and not necessarily the European Standards.

 

So, manufacturers can comply with the technical requirements of the Directive directly, or they can comply with European Harmonised Standards and in that case it provides presumption of conformity to essential H&S.

 

Geez, this is damnably confusing...

 

What's the difference between a Certificate Of Conformity and a Declaration Of Conformity? Is it that the Certificate shows that a product has undergone testing and has been shown to conform? Does the Declaration show that a manufacturer believes there product conforms, even though no official testing has been done?

 

Finally, do we care and is it relevant?

[skyhuck]

Finally, do we care ?

 

I don't