First Aid at work course and Cellox!!!!!

[Justme]

 

We were told it is never a good idea to use CELOX. As stated it makes treating the injury at A&E considerably more difficult.

 

 

But at least you arrive at A&E alive.

 

I agree dont use it for small stuff that can be treated with standard kit but when you have a major bleed that is going to kill you before the ambulance arrives never mind getting to A&E then reach for the Celox.

[Gareth Dalzell]

As others have said, if you ever happen to be in a severe bleed situation and aren't raodside or accessible I,d rather take a chance and use it than wish I had and watch someone bleed to death in front of me. And yes I appreciate that these are exceptional circumstances, but no one ever means to get put in this type of situation and sometimes you have to make a decision based on the information you have in front of you.

 

That said, I,ve just thought of a potential mess-up waiting to happen - that is if someone who doesn't know what is in the cellox package grabs it in an emergency and for example uses it as an eye patch - so I agree there is a danger of putting a lifesaving product in a situation where it could be used incorrectly and cause irrepairable damage. I guess it's a bit like the Defib argument - life saving product in the wrong hands becomes a life endangering product.

 

Good thread - it's making me wonder now about having the product in our kits.

[Minotaur]

Agree with Justme and most of what Gareth said

 

I think its better to have a product that can possibly save you in the eventuality of a major bleed, when there is little or no hope of an Ambulance getting to you in time. Might make it more difficult at A&E for the medics to treat you, but at least you have a chance of getting there alive.

 

Just want to re-iterate that this is an extreme situation use item only!

[Rupe]

Agree with Justme and most of what Gareth said

 

I think its better to have a product that can possibly save you in the eventuality of a major bleed, when there is little or no hope of an Ambulance getting to you in time. Might make it more difficult at A&E for the medics to treat you, but at least you have a chance of getting there alive.

 

Just want to re-iterate that this is an extreme situation use item only!

 

No one is disagreeing with that. Its not on the course though for the reasons mentioned. FAW course is a broad spectrum course for all types of workers in every proffession, there is no reason why celox or many other things should be included in the course, and those who go on the course and expect it to all be about them and them at work only are very shortsighted as to what an the course is all about. Its just here as a minimum standard for employees. Also if one of us walk into a chip shop or a garage or anywhere and witnesses an accident we should be able to grab the standard first aid kit (if we can see it somewhere) with the knowledge that the same stuff should be in there, and vice versa, maybe a client of ours (with FAW training) might grab our kit to help us one day, there shouldnt be anything extra in that green box.

 

My certificate is valid for three years so if I change jobs and go work in an office I have the same certificate there as anybody else. Thats all it is.

[Bombadil]

Yeah, we've just done our first day of a 3 day FAW course run by the Red Cross today.

Wasn't expecting anything arb-specific, but surely that isn't the point of the course? They are teaching general procedures & good practice with the aim of getting a casualty to survive til the cavalry arrive. Whatever it takes, really. If that means using something outside the Green Box like Cellox, fine.

I just don't expect to be taught about it on an official, one-size-fits-all course like this one.

Keep it handy along with the extra large wound dressings, eye wash, tweezers etc etc that live next to the Green Box:thumbup:

[david wood]

Good to see somebody using red cross as a commercial trainer (red cross volunteer here). am sure if near end of course when theres some time to spare if you asked trainer for some arb specific stuff they would help you out, or point you in direction of person who will.

 

There are many many experts in all fields who work for red cross ranging from med students, doctors and paramedics so the advice is there.

 

Also worth mentioning if anyone wants to join red cross as a volunteer for event first aid then its only something like 1 afternoon a month on duty minimum and 3 evenings training a month, possibly less on training front.

in return you can choose to do more stuff and get more training, things like resus support, trauma management and first responder if their area runs it.

 

If not then perhaps look into your areas first responder scheme which will give more training and give you much better access to people who do trauma for a day job so more info freely available.

 

As a plus side for all of those in business with websites its got to be a real nice community promotional tool if you can say you are a member of a first responder scheme and put a link to it on site, makes everyone look like real decent person locally.

[Gareth Dalzell]

Q4: What should I put in the first-aid box?

There is no mandatory list of items to put in a first-aid box. It depends on what you assess your needs to be. As a guide, where work activities involve low hazards, a minimum stock of first-aid items might be.........: Quote from HSE

 

I would wager that if you are carrying the "generic" First Aid kit that is peddled by suppliers that your "First Aid" kit may be lacking in content as it is designed for "low hazard" situations.

 

I agree that we are brain washed into thinking we know what should be in a First Aid box by their suppliers, but do we really consider its contents. And yes I agree that it is better than nothing, but when it hits the fan, it may not been enough.

 

I am not buying into this Standard kit nonsense for our sector - its a bit like a generic risk assessment, you need to add in a site specific.

 

First Aid training for box ticking is better than nothing. We train every member of staff in First Aid and always tell the trainer our profession in advance. I want our teams to be able to react to an industry specific situation as well as general first aid. I also think its a good idea to get them to add in about enfants as some of us have young families. It takes a little time to cover.

 

There, I've got that out of my system - better now:001_smile:

[Minotaur]

Rupe, agree with the bit about the course - see my first post. But thats why I think there is space out there for someone who can offer an Arb oriented course, covering Arb appropriate scenarios and rescue techniques. And then give the guys all the info on products like Cellox, so each of them can make their own informed decision.

 

Bombadil - thats why I think we should have an Arb oriented course

 

David - I I first repond, its a personal choice- each to their own.

[david wood]

hey minotaur,

Good to see another responder on here. a lil shameless promotion there on my part trying to drum up red cross volunteers and responders possibly. even one to take it up is great.

 

David

[ukminch]

It may be that they will not discuss/cover the issue because they feel they are not informed and therefore not insured to cover.

 

 

 

I was impressed by your comments until you said not insured to cover, Id be very interested, and will in fact apologise if your insurance specifies that you cannot cover certain topics. Sorry it's a pet hate of mine with people hiding behind we're not insured for that. I agree with someone saying their not going to cover it because they are not sufficiently informed about it, but to say your not insured is imo nonsense

 

R