loler

[nailer]

In the last 5 years my insurance has gone from £6.5K with no tool cover, too £800 with new for old on my saws and grinders.

 

A bit of healthy competition has certainly seen some drastic price reductions from my previous insurance firm. The ripping-chains are back in the toolbox.

[educated arborist]

Or....

If you under declare you are making a false statement and depending on how they worded the contract they can probably void the contract.

 

If I were an underwriter I know which way I would have written the contract.

 

Correct.

 

Some1 said that £350k must have been a big accident, How much do you think a life is worth??? (i degress somewhat) but if you drop a tree of a house your insurors are pissed but not too pissed, if you injure a person They are REALY REALY Pissed!

 

Spoke to two brokers that are big in arb insurance & one underwriter. All 3 said: Regardless of whether or not a lack of Loler lead to a 'claim/ Benifit' being paid they would seek to take legal action against the policy holder, as the contract would be void. This legal action would seek to recover the benifit payeed plus costs plus an indemnity.

 

Some1 else asked is not having a Loler inspection Illegal? The Loler Regs were made LAW in december 98 and are black & white. Not using a top handled saw one handed is not only not law but it is not prohibited in any guidence or best practice. Why it is you'd think that i don't know.

 

The thorough examination of arboricultural equipment is required by law to be undertaken every 6months for PPE lifting equipment & every 12months for rigging equipment. That is black & white & can not be argued against.

 

Using a saw one handed in the tree due to poor work positioning is against best practice (AFAG 308 etc) but is not LAW per-say. You would however have a hard job arguing that any resulting accident was faultless as industry guidence clearly forbids it.

 

Loler inspection is not only law but it is a good & fair reflection of the condition of your equipment. When assesing your own equiupment (your pre climb & weekly HLWT inspections) there is a high risk of familurarity by which people see defects slowly progress. There are many defects which only your loler inspector will be able to assess the severity & significance of defects; I often have clients ask "and did that not fail?" having assumed the defect was significant. There is also the opposite for instance the old wire spring on a micro grab was absent (allthough that has now been extensivly covered on AT) or stitching on a harness has unpicked symetrically creating the illusion that it is all there.

[John Shutler]

what if a freelance climber who hasnt got his kit lolered comes out of the tree due to equipment failure, i havnt provided his gear. where would you stand

[John Shutler]

 

Using a saw one handed in the tree due to poor work positioning is against best practice (AFAG 308 etc) but is not LAW per-say. You would however have a hard job arguing that any resulting accident was faultless as industry guidence clearly forbids it.

 

 

ASSESSMENT ACTIVITIES

ASSESSMENT CRITERIA

12. Demonstrate knowledge of chain saw handling in exceptional circumstances.

It may be necessary to use a top handled chainsaw in the tree one-handed:

- When working at the extremity of limbs and cutting is required while the other hand is needed to maintain the work position.

- When normal working position cannot be achieved.

[Mesterh]

Spoke to two brokers that are big in arb insurance & one underwriter. All 3 said: Regardless of whether or not a lack of Loler lead to a 'claim/ Benifit' being paid they would seek to take legal action against the policy holder, as the contract would be void. This legal action would seek to recover the benifit payeed plus costs plus an indemnity..

 

Well that shows exactly how low they will stoop, and, well tbh I cant think of the words or sentence but they just plain suck! :thumbdown:

 

The amount of people that I have heard that have had accidents due to kit failure is absolutely zero. People have accidents because of negligence and miss use of equipment.

 

Anyhow LOLER is law unfortunatley so I suppose I will just have to keep filling in and ticking those boxes every 6 months to keep the insurance and HSE happy:thumbup1: ( will obviously be doing it myself though )

[treequip]

what if a freelance climber who hasnt got his kit lolered comes out of the tree due to equipment failure, i havnt provided his gear. where would you stand

 

There are plenty of "ass coverers" that insist on having copies of everything from your 25 yard swimming certificate to your loler inspection, chainsaw certs, machinery inspection, etc.

 

I don’t know how far the powers that be would extend your duty of care to a freelancers kit but if someone were badly hurt or dead the HSE would be looking hard for someone at fault.

[Blakes 7]

what if a freelance climber who hasnt got his kit lolered comes out of the tree due to equipment failure, i havnt provided his gear. where would you stand

 

Your fault for not checking!

[Blakes 7]

If you under declared your turnover, you would be under insured.

 

So if you had under declared by 50%, you would be liable for 50% of the cost of any claim.

 

Unfortunately they would not see it like that. With increased turnover you are more likely to have an accident, if they paid out at all (because you have withheld a material fact) they would be in their rights to pay less than 50%

[Mark Bolam]

Correct.

 

Some1 said that £350k must have been a big accident, How much do you think a life is worth??? (i degress somewhat) but if you drop a tree of a house your insurors are pissed but not too pissed, if you injure a person They are REALY REALY Pissed!

 

Spoke to two brokers that are big in arb insurance & one underwriter. All 3 said: Regardless of whether or not a lack of Loler lead to a 'claim/ Benifit' being paid they would seek to take legal action against the policy holder, as the contract would be void. This legal action would seek to recover the benifit payeed plus costs plus an indemnity.

 

Some1 else asked is not having a Loler inspection Illegal? The Loler Regs were made LAW in december 98 and are black & white. Not using a top handled saw one handed is not only not law but it is not prohibited in any guidence or best practice. Why it is you'd think that i don't know.

 

The thorough examination of arboricultural equipment is required by law to be undertaken every 6months for PPE lifting equipment & every 12months for rigging equipment. That is black & white & can not be argued against.

 

Using a saw one handed in the tree due to poor work positioning is against best practice (AFAG 308 etc) but is not LAW per-say. You would however have a hard job arguing that any resulting accident was faultless as industry guidence clearly forbids it.

 

Loler inspection is not only law but it is a good & fair reflection of the condition of your equipment. When assesing your own equiupment (your pre climb & weekly HLWT inspections) there is a high risk of familurarity by which people see defects slowly progress. There are many defects which only your loler inspector will be able to assess the severity & significance of defects; I often have clients ask "and did that not fail?" having assumed the defect was significant. There is also the opposite for instance the old wire spring on a micro grab was absent (allthough that has now been extensivly covered on AT) or stitching on a harness has unpicked symetrically creating the illusion that it is all there.

 

Did we ever have a satisfactory explanation for this one?

 

LOLER guy one at AA show - pass

LOLER guy two locally - fail

 

Does f-all anyway (the wire), and I would be happy to use it.

[Mesterh]

what if a freelance climber who hasnt got his kit lolered comes out of the tree due to equipment failure, i havnt provided his gear. where would you stand

 

From the sounds of how it all works you would be fecked!

 

So really every freelance we get in we should have the proof of there gear being LOLERED, plus every time we use a crane, hired in mewp, grab wagon etc etc we should get a copy of there LOLER ticket.