Background to the HSE decision on two rope working

[AA Teccie (Paul)]

4 hours ago, TIMON said:

 

Hi Paul,

Hope you’re well. This has been my (main) gripe all along....
I remember hearing about the Utilities sector mandated ’2-rope working’ solution to their guys falling out of trees sometime before the HSE got hold of it... I wondered why they just chose to ‘mask the symptoms’ rather than hold an in-depth review of their working practices. (Maybe they did, but just introducing ‘2 ropes’ doesn’t address the root causes of accidents) Repeated falls from height in utility arb surely points to one or more of the following:

Poor anchor point selection.
Poor rope management
Poor work positioning
Insufficient management, planning and supervision.

Maybe I’m wrong in assuming there wasn’t any detailed investigation into why this was repeatedly happening in that sector... but to arrive at the conclusion that climbers were falling out of trees simply ‘because they weren’t using two ropes’ seems to suggest that the real issues weren’t being addressed.
It is unsurprising that the rest of the industry feel like they are being punished for someone else’s mistakes.

(I know the ICOP and TG1 do cover management and planning work safely)

It will be interesting to see how future accident reporting pans out in the next few years.
T

 

 

Hi Timon, perhaps, at least to some extent, HSE over-simplified the issue by introducing a requirement for 2 systems regardless of how previous incidents / accidents occurred, i.e. a safety net approach...which "on the face of it" is understandable, and hard to argue with (except here! ) 

 

Regardless, and respectfully, "we are where we are" and hope the future is positive...and with less falls.

 

ATB

Paul

 

 

 

[Alexthetreesurgeon]

   But like others have said before.... this 2 rope “safety net” approach is not “understandable” and very easy to “Argue (disagree” with.  This is because It seems many arbs feel that it maybe less safe overall due to number of factors:  

1) More time spent working at height, and the fatigue that accompanies this.

2) increased mental and physical fatigue due to increased rope management. 
3) higher risk of falling/thrown debris hitting a larger target area of rope in the tree.

4) increased likelihood of rigging ropes and climbing rope entanglement.  
Etc etc etc.

 

 I suppose “we are where we are” but I’d rather keep discussing the  implications of this decision with my fellow arbs so that if/when the next accident happens and the discussion is reignited with HSE, fellow arbs feel like they have “back up” hehe and all the information and opinions from the “coal-face.” Furthermore if we properly discuss the “actual” reasons people may be falling from trees we might be able to move towards a more positive future with less falls instead of just hoping for it? ?
    

 

 

[Alexthetreesurgeon]

Please please don’t say safety net just in case HSE get any more bright ideas!!!! 

[openspaceman]

3 hours ago, Alexthetreesurgeon said:

Please please don’t say safety net just in case HSE get any more bright ideas!!!! 

Why not they have them at the circus don't they, and aren't trapeze artists working? ?

[Khriss]

12 minutes ago, openspaceman said:

Why not they have them at the circus don't they, and aren't trapeze artists working? ?

Yea.   And the RA MS says  'persons on site  :  Ring Master, Clowns,  Funny horse and performing dogs' 

 

You gonna walk into court with that  ?  K

[Khriss]

( possibly better luck than the Highways England v Colar  case of late  ?) 

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

2 hours ago, Khriss said:

( possibly better luck than the Highways England v Colar  case of late  ?) 

I was just going to say that ???

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

Squeaky nose and squirting flower optional dress code ?

[openspaceman]

9 minutes ago, kevinjohnsonmbe said:

I was just going to say that ???

something just brushed past my head making a strange sssssound

[Khriss]

45 minutes ago, kevinjohnsonmbe said:

I was just going to say that ???

....... Still waking me up in the night   ?   K