Legal definition of Forestry ?

[devon TWiG]

I own approx 4 acres of woodland in Dartmoor National Park , 60% Douglas fir the rest broadleaf , it is my intention over time to remove quite a bit of the douglas fir and nurture the natural regen and some planting / seeding  to convert it to mostly broadleaf or with a lower canopy of broadleaf , initial operations ( dealing with dead roadside , and other fallen trees etc) has provided me with  firewood for my own personal use (approx 6m3 ) which I have cut , split and stacked ,with a tarpaulin  covering to keep dry ...... recently a planning officer whilst dealing with the siting of a caravan on adjacent land contacted me  with regards to the log piles and stated that I am not allowed to do this as it is considered processing and storage  and requires a change of use as it is not considered "forestry "  I have done some research and some rulings if interpreted in a particular way may lead to this conclusion but to be honest  I am utterly bewildered at such rulings ...... I am not bringing wood in from other locations or selling to others  , but if a qualified / competent person working in a forest ,with wood from said forest using forest equipment /tools is not regarded as forestry then I am at a loss as to what it is ......anyone ever come across this before  ????? 

[Tom D]

In this instance I would suggest that the forestry commission would be quite helpful. Did you get a licence for the felling? if not then you better check that you haven't infringed any felling licence laws. The FC are very keen to get land owners to manage small woodlands and so if you get them on your side that could be a big help with the council. FWIW I think the council are in the wrong, but that doesn't help you. 

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

Does this link to the issue about the vehicle classification and use within the DNP as well DT?  (I'm remembering the thread and thinking it might have been yourself, but not sure.) If it is, and it is related, it sounds like someone is trying to pull your chain.

 

I had a similar question a while back were we discussed what was the legal def of a wood (I think) (not clever enough to try and cross link those 2 potential related threads on the new system yet.) FC provided the best reference which you've probably already seen.    

 

It's not to everyones style of working, but I'd consider telling them to Foxtrot Oscar, send an enforcement letter if you think there's an infringement.  That way, it's THEM having to do the research and fact checking rather than yourself and if the regs don't support an enforcement letter they won't be very credible if they send one.

 

Like I say, not perhaps the most amicable approach but there will come a time when everyone gets a hairy shirt on about so-called 'authority' seeming to exceed said authority - I've had mine on for a while!

[devon TWiG]

1 hour ago, Tom D said:

In this instance I would suggest that the forestry commission would be quite helpful. Did you get a licence for the felling? if not then you better check that you haven't infringed any felling licence laws. The FC are very keen to get land owners to manage small woodlands and so if you get them on your side that could be a big help with the council. FWIW I think the council are in the wrong, but that doesn't help you. 

FC said that what happens to trees after felling is not their dept ,  no felling licence reqd   ( less than 5m3 per calendar  1/4  ), yes it would seem  many people say they would like to see more small woods "managed " however there are too many barriers to this .....my research has lead me to discover such activities as hurdle making , greenwood furniture, spoon carving  , charcoal making etc are not considered "forestry " and are not permitted except ad minimus - less than 28 days per year ....ironically DNP gave a grant to an organisation to encourage bringing coppicng  back in to rotation and  funded courses etc  for training but you are not allowed to process arisings in the woodland  !!!     ( same rules whether in a NP or not  apparently )

Edited July 30, 2017 by devon TWiG

[arcwoodlands]

"the use of buildings and associated land for purposes ancillary to forestry (timber drying and storage, processing, sawmills, and so on) is definitely included within the forestry use as long as the timber involved arises on the same unit"  Mynors in section on GDO and permitted development

[timbernut]

You're not breaching any planning regs! I live and work in a wood and during the 12yr battle we had with the lpa there was never an issue with any of the operations I carry out needing change of use only our residency, charcoal burning, log production etc are seen as forestry activities. Maybe if you put in a prior notification for a small forestry building the enforcement officer would have to look at the guidelines instead of jumping to conclusions. 

[devon TWiG]

Thanks for the replies folks !  ... It does seem that no one considers it wrong in any way to cut and stack firewood in a woodland and I really do not understand where he is coming from , I shall just wait and see what the response is .....

 

[aspenarb]

I think the problem is the size of the woodland, in planning to qualify for prior notification you need in excess of 5 hectares. Under 5 hectares requires full planning for just about anything., being in a national park and an AONB probably wont help either. The LPA may well regard the storing of logs on this site  a commercial enterprise, its worth a visit to the local council to try to get them on your side rather than fight enforcements..

 

Bob

Edited August 1, 2017 by aspenarb

[devon TWiG]

Bob .... I kind of understand what you are saying ....but ...this is not a commercial enterprise ,the logs are for my own use , all of which are from the wood , if I cut them to whatever  size or leave trunks whole and leave them to rot  ( eco pile ) or burn in situ , how can this be considered storage ?   I have no intention of fighting enforcement , ( no enforcement action yet  )  but can not understand on  what grounds they feel they have to prevent me from doing what I am doing  ...   I include a pic of one pile  the planner was not of the opinion that the pallets etc constitute a structure of any kind ........ also the local council is the DNP authority....  Terry ...

Edited August 1, 2017 by devon TWiG

[wills-mill]

On 8/1/2017 at 20:38, aspenarb said:

I think the problem is the size of the woodland, in planning to qualify for prior notification you need in excess of 5 hectares. Under 5 hectares requires full planning for just about anything., being in a national park and an AONB probably wont help either. The LPA may well regard the storing of logs on this site  a commercial enterprise, its worth a visit to the local council to try to get them on your side rather than fight enforcements..

 

Bob

 Much as it pains me to quote Woodlands for Sale, this is quite useful- http://www.woods4sale.co.uk/information-pages/woodland-planning-permission/woodlands-and-planning-legislation.htm

The 5 hectare restrictions are based on an agricultural smallholding, not a forestry or woodland block which has no such restrictions about activities and building size. The National Park side of things may be more relevant, but the planning legislation is much more relaxed for forestry.