Mini Artic

[Dave177]

Looked into a similar thing a while ago but decided for the expense of modifying 2 units it would be easier to just get a larger off the shelf truck.

Only thoughts with what your proposing is wouldnt the truck and trailer over 3.5t need air brakes? I imagine this would be a fairly costly modification?

[donnk]

yes BE pre 2013 seems the way to go as you are right no weight limit on the trailer just Train weight.

 

So the down plate route to avoid any O licence and tacho issues. on a daily the trainweight is 10.5 tons. Downlpate a 6 tonner crew with hiab abd it will be very close to 3 leaving 7ish tons for trailer.

 

All legal!

 

Good read on this thread from a chap vwalan What vehicle to toe 5 tonne? Discussion Printer Version - UKCampsite.co.uk Forums

 

What can possibly go wrong!

[donnk]

[dig-dug-dan]

I saw a similar thing years ago on the nissan stand at saltex. It was a double cab cabstar, with the fith wheel axle, and a purpose built low loader trailer, that had a 6 tonne payload. It never made it into production sadly

[PeteB]

 

Might look like a mini artic but still a Leyland Daf underneath! ooof!

[Justme]

still says

 

Category C1E

You can drive C1 category vehicles with a trailer over 750kg.

 

The combined MAM of both can’t exceed 12,000kg.

 

Anyway that's all a bit of a red herring. 12 ton is plenty in practice. Be interested to your opinion on what you think the max possible weight that can be pulled by a 4 tonner by a driver with a full C1E.

 

tacho not needed for us builders (own goods, less thank 100 from base etc) and restricted O inst much pain either, just a paperwork exercise.

 

The more I think about it the more this makes sense. Assuming around 3-4 ton for the double cab + hiab + tool boxes (would have to be train MAM of 12 ton to be legal but dont see this as a problem for a daily) etc leaves 8 ton for trailer. I would have a cut down plant trailer (low loader type) to move the 5 ton digger and another tipper normal height for general use. Would be very very nice to have 5-6 ton legal carry on the tipper and have a hiab and a crew cab to boot.

 

As your in the trailer trainer game by the looks, I bet there a quite a lot of firms like mine who would use a firm like yours to get the C1E, maybe do a page on your website explaining whats possible as I think you would get loads of work from it.

 

oh just to add more confusion it seems you can downplate a 7.2ton to 3.5 BUT it retains its original train weight.

 

Now try reading the bit I was talking about re BE licences. Nit C1E.

[Justme]

All this down plate to beat the tacho and O licence wont work. The weights used are the total train weights. As soon as it goes over 3500kg you need them except if an exemption applies.

[Justme]

Re the 4 tonnes vehicle on a C1E. If its a wagon and trailer then the real weight of the trailer cant be more than the real weight if the vehicle. If its an artic unit different rules apply.

[donnk]

All this down plate to beat the tacho and O licence wont work. The weights used are the total train weights. As soon as it goes over 3500kg you need them except if an exemption applies.

 

I don't think so, lets put aside the O and tacho as they really don't matter, BE doesn't qualify the max towing weight just train weight as you say.

 

there are lots of fifth wheelers and boat movers using the min artic route on BE. The math does work and you need an old style licence with grandfather rights. When the law changed people kept what they had and were not made illegal overnight.

 

if you have a 3.5 tonner with a plated train of 10.5 tons you can tug 7 tons as long as the trailer is type 3 approved with air brakes/mot etc on a BE grandfather car licence. You must also ensure the axle weights are observed so the trailer needs to be designed with this is mind.

 

I admit this is a large quirk in the rules but does open up possibilities. I'm having a chat with a chap who unlike us both isn't talking theory he owns and drives this setup with vosa approval. This appeals to the large caravan types who otherwise would need a medical to tug this sort of weight.

 

As your in the game maybe worth you getting an opinion from VOSA ?

[donnk]

Justme, here user Rog spells it out on his really informative trailer thread.