Big J

Quite OK - it was really just the finished product I was wanting to see. Jonathan

I do agree that walnut is pretty special. It's something that I very rarely find up here (I have milled a grand total of two walnut trees in my time) which is why I couldn't include it on my list. Fancy popping up a picture or two of the Cadbury's walnut?

It's technically a softwood due to it's reproductive cycle (it's a gymnosperm as opposed to a hardwood, which is an angiosperm) however it is harder than almost any native hardwood. I really do like yew, but it can be quite disappointing to mill unless it's very high quality. Sold quite a bit of it in the last year, but not in terms of general sale. Very specific purposes (whisky boxes and long bows). Jonathan

Very nice indeed. I have seen Burr Poplar before (Lanarkshire hardwoods had a similar tree sawn up) and it's without a doubt lovely. Very rare though.

Like Nick said, I'd just go for a Landcruiser. The VX80 series (later Amazon) has an almost perfect reputation, but as a consequence you do pay for it. They are possibly the most expensive older 4x4 with the exception of the G Wagen. Another alternative to throw in - I've recently become quite enthused about the idea of having VW Touareg V10 TDI. I do quite a bit of towing and 309bhp and 553 lb ft of torque sounds like it would be rather useful. Interesting, they are no more expensive than the 5 cylinder 2.5 TDI despite being better specced and giving away only 4mpg (24mpg versus 28mpg). Definitely not Navara though. As I've regularly said here, mine has been consistently terrible, but just good enough that I haven't got enough time or inclination to get shot of it. Bloody lease purchase agreements.....

Hi Jon, I've always found elm of small diameter to be a pain (basically anything under about 16-18 inches). Elm is a wood that is prone to a lot of distortion whilst drying. Bigger logs tend to be more stable and consequently dry better. However, in your situation (assuming you have a lack of large elm logs), any elm is better than no elm and I would mill it anyway. Jonathan

Oak - everyone always want Oak. It's not a species that I was hugely fond of, but I've grown to love it. The reason I didn't like it earlier on is that it is a swine to dry from green in the kiln. Simply put, don't bother trying. I'm not saying that it cannot be done, as I have done it quite successfully on high quality logs, but you are always advised to air dry first. The market for Oak in the cabinet making world is perhaps the strongest. It's a perennial favourite and the cachet associated with 'I've got an Oak kitchen etc' is ever present. As a consequence of this, I've got about at least 900 cubic foot air drying and about 90-100 cubic foot kilned in stock! Elm - my personal favourite timber. Hard to come by if you are further south (and increasingly scarce up here too). Can be a cow to mill, with straight cuts through burrs and knots a challenge. Dries very readily and can be dried in the kiln from green, though like with all timber, it's advised to air dry first. The price per cubic foot of good elm can be equal to or exceed that of Oak. More so that other species, smaller diameter Elm can be quite poorly behaved whilst drying. Best results I've had have been from very large diameter logs, halved with the chainsaw mill and then milled with the woodmizer beyond that. Good stickering is crucial with Elm as unsupported sections of timber will just move like you wouldn't believe. Ash - strong demand for ash up here. A fairly amiable timber to cut - rarely presents too many problems, though on smaller logs there can be quite a lot of tension sometimes. I find that it is very prone to splitting, with the splits often extending a long way into the board. This can be the case on good quality logs, stacked well and gently air dried. It just seems to do it regardless. Usually more demand of olive ash than clean white ash. Cherry - quite a few cabinets made from cherry, along with consul tables, boxes and coffee tables. Hard to find good quality forest grown stock, so often having to rely on garden trees, that have a shorter stem and usually a healthy quantity of nails. Not a timber that I tend to mill that much of, but usually sells quite well when I do. Sycamore - a good seller for me last year, though not without it's issues. The time to fell and mill sycamore is now. The old adage goes that you should fell a sycamore in the morning, mill it in the afternoon and kiln it in the evening. It's very prone to staining, fungus and all sorts of problems that will see nice, clean white timber turn grey, green or black. Best results are achieved by either air drying with the timber end reared (stood upright) or kilning straight from green. Don't let logs sit around for any amount of time prior to milling as the grey sap staining from the ends moves quickly. I don't have any sycamore in stock at the moment, but will try to get some before the sap comes up again. Jonathan

Christ, now you are asking! From memory, I think it's multiples of 2.3m, but you really are better off asking Steve. He is always in need of it, and is struggling at the moment. He uses about a 3 loads (75t) every 2 months. Regarding diameter, the bigger the better. He has never had a poplar log too large for the Stenner.

I do need to get round the estate with a tame climber and measure a few of the trees that have caught my eye. Notable examples include a 2ft dbh birch with an estimated 85-90ft height, and a 30 inch dbh cherry of the same height. There is a huge sweet chestnut with a measured 64 inch dbh (the trunk is not far off that size for 25ft) and some tall poplars, sycamores and ash on the same banking as the cherry. Anyone fancy a day's recreational climbing on an estate just outside Edinburgh?

If you can cover the cost of the haulage, Steve at Helmdon Sawmill, Brackley, Northamptonshire, will buy it all off you for about £37 a tonne. He has a very specific market for it and it's otherwise not really worth milling. Jonathan

Weekends are fine Paul - at this time of year, if the weather is reasonable, I am probably at work. I have about 30 odd tonnes of roundwood in the yard at the moment, so you are welcome to come and mill something here. If you would like to PM me with contact details, we can go from there. This weekend and next are out, but after that I should be around. Jonathan

True! Rain doesn't even count until it's reached an inch in a day, eh?!

You're forgetting Jon that Steve is in Scotland's West, where a day's sunshine is measured in minutes, not hours! It's no small wonder that his gas bill is high with the perpetual drizzle and cloud!

I am just the other side of the Forth Road Bridge, otherwise there is Pol Bergius (Black Dog Timber) in Forteviot. You are always welcome to come down here. If you want to lend your services as a labourer for a day, we can do a bit of milling, stacking and I can tell you as much or as little as you like about sawing wood!

Thanks for that! I suppose the biggest concern that I have is integrating into the bureaucratic German system. If is a qualifications based culture, and whilst my qualifications are few, I am reasonably experienced in self select thinning and more so in sawmilling. You mentioned in another thread that you had to take a German qualification too - how did you find that, and what did you have to do? How do you find working with your German counterparts? Forestry is a much longer qualification over there than it is here. All I ever did was take my CS30-31 and then start cutting. I would regard myself as being a pretty reasonable cutter (particular attention to tidiness - must be the half German side of me) but I think that I would be outclassed by folk that have trained for years in a system that frankly does a much better job of managing it's forests than we do. How did you find general social integration in terms of finding a house, setting up a bank account, driving licences/insurance and all that jazz. It's daft really, as I speak German fairly competently and have family there, but I do regard a move to Germany as a major thing. It's incredible how quickly you establish yourself in an area (Edinburgh for us) and the thought of the upheaval is terrifying. Thanks in advance. Jonathan

Whilst it's always very good to have timber to practice milling on in the early days, I wouldn't both milling that particular stem. Stick to a main trunk and you will have far fewer problems. Mill first, then season. It's just not possible the other way around. My chainsaw milling experience has been virtually exclusively with an 088, so I cannot comment on an 066. If the heart is centrally located within the branch, it might be worth milling to practice, but still expect much more movement than you would get with a main stem. Keep us in the loop!

My wife and I are thinking of moving to Germany also - I started a thread about it a couple of weeks ago (I would link you to it but each time I view the page the address bar simply says arbtalk dot com, and nothing else - just search German and it comes up). I spent a lot of time there as a child and I remember so many trees. I could walk out of my grandmothers garden on the edge of Osnabruck and immediately be in Beech forest that would stretch for miles. Paths everywhere and adventure stations throughout (climbing frames, swings, slides, monkey bars etc). In Germany I believe that they are far stricter on qualification, so make sure that you well up to date on everything (including first aid I would think). I really can't offer much advise at this stage as we are simply in the initial stages of investigation ourselves. All I can do is offer encouragement and say go for it! Jonathan

I don't seal the ends of my timber generally, simply because it's another stage to a quite labour intensive process. I find that the checking in the ends of the boards are largely dependent on the underlying quality of the timber and the time that it was felled. I cite the example of a batch of high quality oak milled at the start of April. Really a bit late to mill oak, but given the cooler climate here and the barn I have (cool, almost a touch damp but with good air flow and no direct sunlight) it's dried/is drying beautifully. I put some of the 1.5 and 1.25 inch stock into the kiln in October last year (MC of 23-28% prior to kilning) and it has dried with no end shake at all. Contrary to that, I chain milled some generally good quality oak in July (timber had to be moved from site, no machine access) and it has shaken fairly badly at the ends. I suspect that both processes would have occurred with the ends sealed, though I am happy to be proved wrong. Either way, I agree with your advice regarding the walnut butt. Treebloke - perhaps send Slackbladder (Steve Slack) a message as he is in the market for a bit of walnut. Jonathan

Well I'm certainly open to offers! I would need to sort the LM2 on my end though. I have no experience with the Hudson Mills. Clive - I'm sure that they could do something on two mills....

You are correct - on closer inspection there are hydraulic rollers and a clamp. I had the Woodmizer rep for the Northwest (Martin Phillips) service it. Very nice chap and did a good job. My best advice would be to start with a non hydraulic mill first to establish your market. Once you've done that, invest in a more expensive mill. You will already know what you do and don't want from your experience with the cheaper saw. Jonathan

Log Master

For the benefit of those in the area, could you please post photos of the tree? This will give them a better idea of potential value prior to felling. Beyond that, once the tree is down, it's crucial to see a sawn end to judge the proportion sapwood to heartwood.

No UK dealer, but Woodmizer UK don't have the best reputation for parts anyway. I had mine serviced last year and the (Woodmizer rep) chap doing it had to fabricate some pretty basic bed aligning bolts, of which there are about a dozen of on the machine. Woodmizer UK didn't have any, nor the factory in Poland apparently. Looking at the LT20 specs (a machine that I am admittedly not familiar with), there looks to be little that is hydraulic on it other than log loading. Maximum log size of 32 inch isn't ideal either. Logmaster are looking for distributors I think, so there could be potential there. Jonathan

Very good thread - somehow slipped me by and I've enjoyed reading it to catch up (excellent contributions from Alec). Regarding bandsaws, the blade costs are quite small. I find that I typically get through a band every 50 cubic foot. Sharpening costs are about £7 a band, so it works out at 14 pence a cubic foot, which when you consider the average price when kiln dried is about £32, is a small cost. Look at your woodland and try to realise the maximum value for each tree species. If you have ash, try to cut the lowest section of the butt for hurley sticks. If you have good quality yew, longbows. If you have beech, make chopping boards. If sweet chestnut, garden furniture and fencing. Oak, just about anything. Sycamore, chopping boards. Lots of possibilities. To chime in on which saw to get, I'd recommend having a small bandsawmill with chainsawmill backup. Jonathan

You've got me thinking again about the Logmaster! Price for the LM2 (21ft 6" x 36 inch log capacity - same diameter and 1ft long than the Woodmizer) with 38hp Kohler Petrol (diesel is a $5500 option) and hydraulic debarker is only £16600 plus delivery and import taxes (about 1.5%). I reckon I could almost sell my Woodmizer and buy that without incurring extra cost. The thought of a nice new mill without a single electric motor (all hydraulic) is very tempting. Jonathan