Ariel rescue advice.

[Andy Collins]

Cerne, so did you cover all the relevant CS units, but were not assessed? Or did you not cover them at all? If you covered the units, but were not assessed, Were there any underlying reasons why you may not have been pushed forward for assessment?

When I did my CS units, there was 2 people who showed no aptitude for chainsaw use whatsoever, from basic maintenance to cross-cutting, these were not put forward for assessment, as it was deemed that in no way would they be competent to use saws. With colleges struggling with league tables, surely pass rates become even more important, so if several people were to fail assessment, the college pass rate falls, then so does investment in future courses.

Please dont take this as a personal attack on you, just trying to understand if there is a reason.

[skyhuck]

Reading threads like this really worries me.

 

Excuse my ignorance, but am I right in thinking that the collages take people who have never used chainsaws and try to teach them in a year how to use a saw and then how to use a saw up a tree?

 

I have had no formal training at all, I have taken and passed my NPTC assessments.

 

I started to use a chainsaw at age 21 when I was newly married and skint. The estate I live on had many dead Elms which I began felling for fire wood, my father had been felling and cutting his own firewood for years and he assisted me with the first tree and I took it from there, tree felling is basically applied mathematics and geometry.

At 24 I got a job as a groundie with a firm doing line clearance, I saw the climbers and thought WOW that looks great I'd love to do that! and when I realised they were on twice as much money as me I was even keener. I bought some second hand climbing gear of one of the guys (had to sell my push bike as I was still skint) They allowed me to have a go when there was time. At weekends I would dismantle my dead Elms instead of felling them.

 

I have rambled on a bit, but the point I am trying to make is that when I first went up a tree with a chainsaw using the saw was second nature to me and the "new" thing was were I was using it!

 

To be "new" to chainsaws and "new" climbing is, IMO, madness and may well be one of the reasons we keep reading about accidents.

[Steve Bullman]

Reading threads like this really worries me.

 

Excuse my ignorance, but am I right in thinking that the collages take people who have never used chainsaws and try to teach them in a year how to use a saw and then how to use a saw up a tree?

.

 

what concerns me more dave, is i have heard of at least 2 instances where said students at the end of their course have stayed on as instructors!!

[The Tree Hunter]

We've got that at ours, although i wouldn't say he's an instructor, but helps out the instructor that teaches us. I think most people on our course that are serious about a job in Arb, are quite realistic that we are only being given the basics, from which we can start off, you'd have to be very naive to think that fresh out of college, anyone would have the proper skills to start cracking on with some of the jobs shown in the video section on here......hopefully it'll give us some good footings to start off with and then progress from there!!! Well at least thats how i see it!!!!

[Gaynor]

Reading threads like this really worries me.

 

Excuse my ignorance, but am I right in thinking that the collages take people who have never used chainsaws and try to teach them in a year how to use a saw and then how to use a saw up a tree?

 

I have had no formal training at all, I have taken and passed my NPTC assessments.

 

I started to use a chainsaw at age 21 when I was newly married and skint. The estate I live on had many dead Elms which I began felling for fire wood, my father had been felling and cutting his own firewood for years and he assisted me with the first tree and I took it from there, tree felling is basically applied mathematics and geometry.

At 24 I got a job as a groundie with a firm doing line clearance, I saw the climbers and thought WOW that looks great I'd love to do that! and when I realised they were on twice as much money as me I was even keener. I bought some second hand climbing gear of one of the guys (had to sell my push bike as I was still skint) They allowed me to have a go when there was time. At weekends I would dismantle my dead Elms instead of felling them.

 

I have rambled on a bit, but the point I am trying to make is that when I first went up a tree with a chainsaw using the saw was second nature to me and the "new" thing was were I was using it!

 

To be "new" to chainsaws and "new" climbing is, IMO, madness and may well be one of the reasons we keep reading about accidents.

As I've said before, I have just finished a Nat. Cert. in Arb and yes, there are people who were on my course that are now running their own business, but I would have to agree with you that I would be concerned about the quality of the work they deliver. Surely they're just 'cutting stuff'. They know about the saw and they know how to climb but they know very little about the trees. I'm running my own landscaping and maintenance business and will do tree work if requested, but until such time as I've had a lot more experience climbing or even just groundy-ing, I'm not prepared to advertise solely as a tree surgeon.

IMO, experience is worth far more than qualifications, but far better to have both.

P.S. Anyone in my area want a groundy for 2 days a week, I'd be very interested. Reasonable rates of pay accepted, I won't charge you for the wit and sarcasm!!!

[skyhuck]

what concerns me more dave, is i have heard of at least 2 instances where said students at the end of their course have stayed on as instructors!!

 

That is truly unbelievable!!!!!!!!!!!

[ecolojim]

ive heard of that too, cant remember which establishment, and probably wouldnt say if i could remember but top 1 or 2 out of each year offered instructor places.

[cerneARB]

Cerne, so did you cover all the relevant CS units, but were not assessed? Or did you not cover them at all? If you covered the units, but were not assessed, Were there any underlying reasons why you may not have been pushed forward for assessment?

Please dont take this as a personal attack on you, just trying to understand if there is a reason.

 

No problem Andy:001_smile:.

 

We did cover the Cs units. But we only paid for the one assment in our course fees during the year the CS30-31. This is what i dont get though we covered the units on cross cutting , saw maintence , small tree felling , climbing but not rescue.?

 

 

Think the course at Otley needs a better structure. In my veiw i think they wanted to retain last years students by giving them one assement and one CS unit i year.. so they had to come back the next year ,i may be wrong thats not gospel just a theroy.

[Andy Collins]

In one week, you can cover the ground cs units and another your climbing cs units, 1 day I beliieve to assess each category. Within 3 weeks without going to college, surely you would have more assessed tickets than a year on a course? I know you cover loads of other issues in that year, but without tickets you're as much use as a chocolate teapot in the big wide world.

[Rich Rule]

Some of the college courses offer the training to NPTC/Lantra levels but do not guarantee an assessment or ticket at the end of it to cover themselves of the numpty who think they can be tree surgeons. Where as, some courses offer a basic qualification in arb along with cs units blah blah blah etc. when i was at college we certainly had a few people who were no where near the required level of an NPTC pass so why waste the time and money by putting them forward for assessment.

 

IMO the colleges offer a good intro to the world of arb but once you get a job the real learning begins. I am still learning everyday and hopefully will continue this trend for a long time.