Are all the NPTC units necessary?

[SAM66S]

Hi,

 

Was just wondering if all the units are necessary as some seem to overlap. for example would you need CS44 if you already had CS 32/33? and CS45 if you had 38/39/40/41?

 

Thanks

[Paul Jenks]

Depends what you mean by necessary. If you know how to sharpen/maintain a saw, is it necessary to have a ticket? If you know how to climb a tree, is it necessary to have a ticket?

Generally, if you are carrying out an operation or series of operations commercially you should have the relevent tickets. This doesn't show you can do the job well but for insurance purposes, and sometimes piece of mind, you and your staff are covered should anything go wrong.

If a member of staff injures themself on a chainsaw, HSE and your insurers will want to see certificates to show that firstly the saw was maintained by a competent person, complete with documented evidence of PUWER checks, and that the person was certificated to use the saw and that they were certificated to carry out the operation they were carrying out.

Sometimes it all seems a bit draconian but ultimately if we as an industry are going to get the respect in the work place we feel we deserve we need to start complying with current legislation more often than not.

At least then if we do bend the rules a little the operation is backed up with a good deal of training we are less likely to get injured or damage anything.

[button1803]

Depends what you mean by necessary. If you know how to sharpen/maintain a saw, is it necessary to have a ticket? If you know how to climb a tree, is it necessary to have a ticket?

Generally, if you are carrying out an operation or series of operations commercially you should have the relevent tickets. This doesn't show you can do the job well but for insurance purposes, and sometimes piece of mind, you and your staff are covered should anything go wrong.

If a member of staff injures themself on a chainsaw, HSE and your insurers will want to see certificates to show that firstly the saw was maintained by a competent person, complete with documented evidence of PUWER checks, and that the person was certificated to use the saw and that they were certificated to carry out the operation they were carrying out.

Sometimes it all seems a bit draconian but ultimately if we as an industry are going to get the respect in the work place we feel we deserve we need to start complying with current legislation more often than not.

At least then if we do bend the rules a little the operation is backed up with a good deal of training we are less likely to get injured or damage anything.

 

Very well said mate!

[SAM66S]

Sorry i proberly should have written that a little better, i realise that having the relevant tickets are essential, was just asking the question are all of the units a must have?? For instants if you have CS33 felling large trees would you need CS44 felling standing stems? Etc. thanks for the help

[Brushcutter]

CS44 is an interesting unit. I'm sure when i did the training you could use any size saw you wanted rather than the standard 15" bar. Which is good because you don't really get any training on bars bigger than 18".

 

There is a lot of overlap between CS32 and CS33. If you fell a medium tree you should be able to fell a large one. In reality it's a bit harder than that but it's mainly experence that is the key with larger felling. Standing stems i was taught you could make the face cut a bit deeper to change the centre of gravity slightly.

 

With the windblow CS34,35 & 50 there is a hell of a lot of overlap but it is just good refresher training.

[AA Teccie (Paul)]

Interestingly I've just looked up the NPTC assessment schedules and it would appear as tho CS44 has been withdrawn, or at least it certainly doesn't apear on there (curently!)

 

Anyway that was just an example of the point you raised asking are 'ALL' NPTC units necessary, and quite rightly point out that many seemingly overlap/duplicate. As we all know training and assssments cost a lot of money and once attained then need updating/refreshing at some later date menaing more cost...hence one has to be sensible and pragmatic.

 

In terms of the 'ArbAC' scheme we expect to see a good cross section of NPTCs, and other training, across the company.

 

As a minimum we would expect CS30/31/32 on the ground, and CS34/35 if Highways Emergency call-out is in place (BUT this is also a good ground unit to do as a 'refresher/update'.) Aerially CS38(as was)/39/41, and CS47 if MEWP operators not climbing.

 

Once in place the BIG issue then becomes effective refreshers and updates, often investigated by HSE in event of an accident, and currently key areas are 'climbing' and 'rigging' as these have advanced considerably, with technologies and techniques changing, in the last few years. These are alos requirements for 'ArbAC'.

 

Hope this to be of help..

Paul

 

PS In actual answer to your question...NO.

[bob]

Hi

Similar really but just to say some of the units are there for specifics

Ie if you look at the pollarding unit it was just done for mainly EA guys and was tailored to just them so they did not have to do 38 39 40 41

and the felling poles or stems were for the utility guys dropping telegraph poles so what was the point in them doing 30,31 for a full week that did not actually teach them to do a single stem

CS50 again is different to 34 but was done mainly for highway guys and callout guys as CS32 is not a pre requisite so again to fit a reality hole.

Supply and demand really

Hope that made sense

[will.morris]

Out of interest, what kind of percentage of people in the game hold a chipper ticket would people say? I've worked for various arborists and did 3 years using a chipper for a huge company without a ticket for it ... waste of money or do most people get it??

[Tom2020]

Most new arbs have a chipper ticket now will just one of those things you Get now I think its only came in and is a new unit i know loads of people who dont have the chipper ticket and now being told they carn't use the chipper

 

Same the more tickets you have the better in my book having the basic tickets dosent seem to be good enough now If you say to a employer I have cs30,31 good and well But if some bloke comes in and says I have cs30,31,32,33,38,39,40,41,42 with stump grinder and chipper along with pa1 and pa6 There going to hire the other person as they are ticketed up to there eyes it costs loads but will one day be worth it

[will.morris]

Can't argue with that! At my old company we did a 2 hour inhouse training which apparently was enough for us to use one ... not quite sure how that would stand up if insurance had to come into play. Pa1 & Pa6 are very useful to have, did mine through the same company, almost enough on its own to walk into a basic grounds maintenance position.