Dual cab pickups ....

[GarethM]

3 hours ago, Mike Hill said:

 

Sure. Let's investigate the only electric pickup that can tow 3.4 Tonn.

 

The gigantic Ford F150 lightning,base price about £50K,so you would have to import it,convert it to right hand drive. Back of fag packet breakdown below.

 

Base Vehicle £50k

Domestic transport to port £3k

Shipping to Scotland £2.5k

Shipping inside the UK £1500

Vat,import and handling fees £11,000

Conversation to rh drive £10,000 easy

 

£78,000 now it's on the road,so now it will have about 1/3 the range of a Diesel when towing. Sadly there is a lack of charging facilities pretty much anywhere off the main routes anywhere I know. So let's buy a nice big 10kva  generator to sit on the deck. 

£3000

 

This can run all day as Dave is milling,providing of course he gets to the job on a single charge. But and it is a big but,the short charging frequency will rinse his battery. Sadly the batt packs in pretty much any electric vehicle are non replaceable ,so be prepared to scrap the truck in four years in order to buy another.

 

His clients won't buy his services any longer,and since of course every Miller in Scotland bought and electric wagon thus charging a fortune. The timber now goes to firewood and the dimensional Oak gets imported from the Baltics where they don't give a toss about HSE or emissions.  Perfect!

I've got this amazing idea, why not lift the bonnet and put that generator in there.

 

Efficient, streamline and improve the look, surely the green types would prefer the aesthetic and you can put eco stickers all over it ?

[Steven P]

7 hours ago, Mike Hill said:

 

Sure. Let's investigate the only electric pickup that can tow 3.4 Tonn.

 

The gigantic Ford F150 lightning,base price about £50K,so you would have to import it,convert it to right hand drive. Back of fag packet breakdown below.

 

Base Vehicle £50k

Domestic transport to port £3k

Shipping to Scotland £2.5k

Shipping inside the UK £1500

Vat,import and handling fees £11,000

Conversation to rh drive £10,000 easy

 

£78,000 now it's on the road,so now it will have about 1/3 the range of a Diesel when towing. Sadly there is a lack of charging facilities pretty much anywhere off the main routes anywhere I know. So let's buy a nice big 10kva  generator to sit on the deck. 

£3000

 

This can run all day as Dave is milling,providing of course he gets to the job on a single charge. But and it is a big but,the short charging frequency will rinse his battery. Sadly the batt packs in pretty much any electric vehicle are non replaceable ,so be prepared to scrap the truck in four years in order to buy another.

 

His clients won't buy his services any longer,and since of course every Miller in Scotland bought and electric wagon thus charging a fortune. The timber now goes to firewood and the dimensional Oak gets imported from the Baltics where they don't give a toss about HSE or emissions.  Perfect!

 

 

 

 

 

 

It was you that mentioned emissions, I never considered that as a consideration here.

 

My argument here is do you actually need the double cab vehicle sat in the yard, costing the business money and not moving or making money for 300 days of the year. For a financial business case get a single cab, avoid this tax (which is written off against profits anyway) and cheaper to run. For the (guess here) 20 or so days you take your both your mates onto a job use the savings to get them a taxi, hire car, or own vehicle use plus paid expenses for the day. Business makes more money which is after all why we work.

 

A different case of course if said van was being used for the full 220-ish day working year taking a team of 3 or 4 to site and back, then the finances say it is better to own or lease it.

[GarethM]

1 hour ago, Steven P said:

 

It was you that mentioned emissions, I never considered that as a consideration here.

 

My argument here is do you actually need the double cab vehicle sat in the yard, costing the business money and not moving or making money for 300 days of the year. For a financial business case get a single cab, avoid this tax (which is written off against profits anyway) and cheaper to run. For the (guess here) 20 or so days you take your both your mates onto a job use the savings to get them a taxi, hire car, or own vehicle use plus paid expenses for the day. Business makes more money which is after all why we work.

 

A different case of course if said van was being used for the full 220-ish day working year taking a team of 3 or 4 to site and back, then the finances say it is better to own or lease it.

Oh so instead of one vehicle you want 2/3 yeah soooooooo great for the planet.

 

The more you try to argue why, the less I actually respect your very poor foundations of an argument.

 

Next you'll be telling me I should rent a tractor by the hour because I'm not spending 8 hours a day 365 in it.

 

Have nothing and be happy, as Klas would say. It's just a F'in communism ideology 

Edited March 27 by GarethM

[Steven P]

Not at all Gareth, If the argument is that you don't like the tax on double cabs because they are not a perk then the business case behind the business owning one has to be solid. This includes financially. To have it sat in the yard for 300 days of the year, not moving, then the finances don't add up. If the van is used on those the 300 days outside of business use then it is a perk and should be taxed as such, the same as we all pay for other work perks we might get

 

[GarethM]

25 minutes ago, Steven P said:

Not at all Gareth, If the argument is that you don't like the tax on double cabs because they are not a perk then the business case behind the business owning one has to be solid. This includes financially. To have it sat in the yard for 300 days of the year, not moving, then the finances don't add up. If the van is used on those the 300 days outside of business use then it is a perk and should be taxed as such, the same as we all pay for other work perks we might get

Sorry but that's absolute bs.

 

You can use the same oh it's not working for practically every piece of equipment I and every other business owner has.

 

We have it because it does a job, be that once a year or every day. If I need something I buy it outright without finance.

[GarethM]

As you like numbers, say I did get a pickup and we had the tax deduction regardless of who drives it at say 28mpg average.

 

So I've saved say 10k tax for example, well 28mpg Vs say 60mpg is 33 miles difference.

 

Me thinks the government is going to make that back missing tax pretty quickly on fuel duty and ved!.

[Steven P]

I think this comes down to me basically not believing that the double cab in this instance is going to be sat in the yard for 300 days of the year and never get taken out the yard unless there is work to do. Double cab and I'd be very much inclined to believe that it is also used as a general run around, taking the family out and so on, as such having the business provide for such is a perk. 

 

In the case of much of the equipment we use it would be tricky to work out how it could b used for anything other than business use. Hardly likely to pop down to the shops with chainsaw as a fashion accessory (though that might be just me). Day trip to the beach? Take the sawmill out, will make a great base for the BBQ.

[GarethM]

16 minutes ago, Steven P said:

I think this comes down to me basically not believing that the double cab in this instance is going to be sat in the yard for 300 days of the year and never get taken out the yard unless there is work to do. Double cab and I'd be very much inclined to believe that it is also used as a general run around, taking the family out and so on, as such having the business provide for such is a perk. 

 

In the case of much of the equipment we use it would be tricky to work out how it could b used for anything other than business use. Hardly likely to pop down to the shops with chainsaw as a fashion accessory (though that might be just me). Day trip to the beach? Take the sawmill out, will make a great base for the BBQ.

The government is hardly getting something for nothing are they, regardless of how you're using it.

 

You understand why HGVs aren't taxed into oblivion because the ved is low ISH because they drink fuel like an addict.

 

At the end of the day the business has made that money, there are few perks to being self employed.

 

Taking a salary isn't the same, we get shafted left, right and centre and have to sort pensions etc, a rare sweetener is needed just to make it better than saying sod the lot of you and making a dole claim for mental health or some other made up excuses.

 

And we also get done over for commercial vehicle insurance, so Peds and his Passat won't have the same 1-2k insurance 

Edited March 27 by GarethM

[Steven P]

The tax in question is because it is a perk of the employment, you get to use it as your own and the business picks up the tab for lease / purchase, insurance, maintenance, tax, new tyres, whatever, (and I am sure 'some' fuel). So the HGV example doesn't really equate, it is in the same bracket as a mill, chainsaw or chipper - you are highly unlikely to pop down to the beach in your Scania when it is sunny. No perk, tax doesn't apply.

[GarethM]

20 minutes ago, Steven P said:

The tax in question is because it is a perk of the employment, you get to use it as your own and the business picks up the tab for lease / purchase, insurance, maintenance, tax, new tyres, whatever, (and I am sure 'some' fuel). So the HGV example doesn't really equate, it is in the same bracket as a mill, chainsaw or chipper - you are highly unlikely to pop down to the beach in your Scania when it is sunny. No perk, tax doesn't apply.

Maybe one day when you actually have a job position that's not on a salary you'll actually understand.

 

You seem to equate every sod driving one as some massive company screwing over HMRC, reality is the UK is primarily small businesses.

 

Just don't equate your boss turning up in his chauffeur driven Merc with a pickup truck. Its people in those trucks that keep this country running, not Rupert off on his 3rd ski trip of the season.

Edited March 27 by GarethM