Client ignores advice, who is liable?

[Joe Newton]

27 minutes ago, AHPP said:

 

 

Definition from where?

Arbtalk

[AHPP]

2 hours ago, Joe Newton said:

Arbtalk

 

In fairness that could be part of making it what it is, if it is anything. Contractual terms can be implied by widespread use. I think 'reasonably notorious in the industry' is the test from Shirlaw v Southern Foundries. Wouldn't be hard for negligence to borrow law from contract to help decide whether someone portrayed themself as a contractor or consultant. 

 

Edited Monday at 22:19 by AHPP

[zippysluggish]

Update to my story.

 

After a lot of thought on what to say to the customer and trying to keep it professional, I just suggested that  he should prioritise the tree over the hedges if it's a question of finance .

I emphasised that ,in my opinion the tree is a potential hazard which he is responsible for. I also suggested he get another opinion from other tree surgeons or the local tree officer .

 

My thoughts for suggesting he rings the tree officer is that he would be reporting himself to the authorities.

 

He replied with he always was going to get the tree done but at a later date when the leaves have gone!

 

What difference the leaves being on or off makes towards the safety of the tree I don't know.

 

The upshot is his now having the tree and the hedges done . 

 

Thanks for all the great advice.

 

Daren

[Mark Bolam]

Result.

Nice one.

[daltontrees]

On 24/06/2024 at 07:18, Joe Newton said:

Balls to the customer. If he's more concerned about his hedges than the safety of others, I'd say you have a higher obligation to the general public. 

The only risk is to the neighbour, not the public. And we don't know if the customer is going to deal with it in some other way. So it's a  big assumption to make that the public will be endangered IF only the ash tree is removed, AND its removal destabilises the neighbour's tree. IF! AND! Here's another if. If I allowed a contractor onto my land to price a jonb and he went off to tell on me for something that might maybe perhaps at some time in the future affect my neighbour if I gave him paid work to remove my tree, I'd be livid. I think almost everyone on Arbtalk would be too.

You seem to have escalated this in your mind from trivial, private and unlikely to serious, imminent public risk.

Edited Tuesday at 08:37 by daltontrees

[daltontrees]

17 hours ago, Mark Bolam said:

 

This sums up what is wrong with modern life Jules.

 

If a customer mentioned to me he was going to go into a school on a machine gun rampage do you think I shouldn’t report him?

 

A tight-arsed prick like this one wouldn’t be my customer for long anyway, so it’s no great loss.

It's hardly a machine gun rampage. Reporting a customer for not accepting your advice would be petty and pathetic and in the circumstances unnecessary. A sure recipe for getting a reputation as a contractor for being a weirdo and untrustable.

So... get given the hedge work then report him for some vague future risk to a neighbour. How does thats look in anyones eyes? You might (you would) lose this customer, but if I was friends with the customer and heard about this I woudn't let you anywhere near my property to price work. Because you would be a snooper. Lose the odd job yes. Lose your good reputation, never.

[Mark Bolam]

Jules, I’m talking about the second scenario where the tree is in imminent danger of falling into a busy road.

 

The neighbours elm I would just give my opinion and move on.

[daltontrees]

14 minutes ago, Mark Bolam said:

Jules, I’m talking about the second scenario where the tree is in imminent danger of falling into a busy road.

 

The neighbours elm I would just give my opinion and move on.

He didn't quite say imminent danger, he said pretty sure its going to fall over as some point. But yes the target is a public area.

Maybe customer just didn't like the price. Contractor has done the right thing and warned the customer. But it's the same principle, you let someone onto your land and they report you to the authorities. Definitely wouldn't get the hedge work. Definitely would get the contractor the reputation of being someone you couldn't trust.

I am a bit cynical, I formally assess the risk from about 200 trees a week, and it is quite rare to find any that need to be dealt with with any urgency. The usual perception of risk is poor condition whereas the real risk is often the severity and the likelihood of someone or something being present at the time of failure. Without that information a 'sooner rather than later' prognosis doesn't quite merit breach of client confidentiality.

Besides, it's always going to look like it was reported because the contractor didn't get the work. And that's a bad look.

[Mark Bolam]

That’s not the point.

Any cretin who prioritises a hedge trim over a dangerous tree (for the same price) is undeserving of any of what’s left of my professionalism.

[Joe Newton]

8 hours ago, Mark Bolam said:

Jules, I’m talking about the second scenario where the tree is in imminent danger of falling into a busy road.

 

 

As was I, which i thought was obvious enough in my post.

 

Weigh up in your mind how you might feel about reading about that tree on the news where someone had been injured or worse.