Day rates: why so cagey?

[Dendrologen]

Why are people so cagey about their day rates? Surely if we were open,  it would reduce the variability? Also, why do employers try to force people down on their rates? They shouldn't be calling the shots.  You just invoice the client for that person's rate.  If it's extortionate, fair enough to question, but in my opinion, we shouldn't be haggling subbies down, so we can charge a higher rate for them and skim a bit off the top. If you've worked out your overheads right, you add them to your price for the job and whatever you need to make a bit of profit. Honesty is the best policy imo. It's been difficult for me to set a rate and it seems I can charge anything from £150 to over £200 a day in Devon. £150 ain't enough to run a business, pay into a pension, cover sick days,  holiday etc. Someone please tell me what you gain from the lack of openness?

[pleasant]

'You just invoice the client for that person's rate.  If it's extortionate, fair enough to question'

 

...because one mans perception of 'extortionate' is another mans 'fair'

[eggsarascal]

You don't employ anyone not to make money off them, on the books, or contractors, if your rate is £200 I'd up that to the client.

[Dendrologen]

4 minutes ago, pleasant said:

'You just invoice the client for that person's rate.  If it's extortionate, fair enough to question'

 

...because one mans perception of 'extortionate' is another mans 'fair'

I don't think that's why people are so cagey. I think this leads to the variability of expectations. I believe that if we are all open about what we charge, prices would even out so there was less variability. The subbie would have more control as they know what is reasonable/avg for their area and what other people will pay. We would have a better idea of what's extortionate.

[Retired Climber]

Serious question; are you quite new to business / self employment?

[Dendrologen]

1 minute ago, eggsarascal said:

You don't employ anyone not to make money off them, on the books, or contractors, if your rate is £200 I'd up that to the client.

So have a fixed rate that you ad on per subbie,  rather than thinking "haha,  this highly skilled mug only charges 120 quid a day, so I can make an extra xxx quid out of them". 

[Steve Bullman]

Personally the only person who needs to know what I’m charging is the person I’m doing business with. What anyone else’s day rate is is entirely irrelevant really. Everyone brings something different to the table and has their own set of circumstances and overheads and need to set their rates accordingly  

[Dendrologen]

3 minutes ago, Retired Climber said:

Serious question; are you quite new to business / self employment?

I'm just starting out self employed. Been working with trees for many years.

[Dendrologen]

2 minutes ago, Steve Bullman said:

Personally the only person who needs to know what I’m charging is the person I’m doing business with. What anyone else’s day rate is is entirely irrelevant really. Everyone bring me something different to the table and has their own set of circumstances and overheads and needs to set their rates accordingly  

So your rate is not at all influenced by what other people charge? Nice to be in that position

[pleasant]

5 minutes ago, Dendrologen said:

I don't think that's why people are so cagey. I think this leads to the variability of expectations. I believe that if we are all open about what we charge, prices would even out so there was less variability. The subbie would have more control as they know what is reasonable/avg for their area and what other people will pay. We would have a better idea of what's extortionate.

I wasn't referring to the 'cagey' side of things......just the point you made about why people question your rates...You said if it's extortionate, fair enough. What I may consider is extortionate could well be completely different to what you consider fair.....hence why people question.