Brexit ! what will this mean ? ( lets get a good thread going )

[WesD]

3 minutes ago, Vespasian said:

 

Ah, but I do know what I'm looking for..   I'm looking for a united Europe at peace with itself.   a strong Europe that protects its borders and interests...

A Europe capable of projecting military power beyond its borders..

Well you will be looking for a long time, the nations within the EU are not on a parity. 

All pay different rates, all being told to take different amounts of immigrants reducing coal power by varying amounts. 

All with varying amounts of debt paying back interest before being able to spend on public services. 

 

Watch Greece with Simon Reeves and Turkey with Simon Reeves, some nations are in to take others are told to give, Germany is far from stable at the moment the EU will end up in a civil war when the rich nations become too elite for the poor within it. 

 

Protecting borders is quite rich seeing that its opened them.

 

We have the UN and NATO to project military power. 

[javelin10]

What a busy weekend it's been on here!

1 minute ago, WesD said:

Why dont you emigrate to North Korea or Russia, sounds like it may be your cup of tea. 

Bit unfair? Churchill said much the same thing: "The only good thing about Democracy is that it's better than any of the alternatives" or words to that effect. He didn't much like tyrants, if I remember correctly?

 

Everybody seems to have their own idea of 'Democracy' and when you press them it usually boils down to "I am a normal person with normal views and only my version of common sense is the true version so it follows that everyone who disagrees with me and gets their way is subverting democracy somehow."

 

When minorities get protected, that is undemocratic, when our elected representatives do things we don't like, that is also undemocratic. Our modern, 'Liberal' democratic system evolved out of the lessons of ancient Athens; the only 'pure' democracy I know of, where the majority ended up oppressing the minority and everything collapsed in civil war. So much for 'proper' democracy.

[javelin10]

WesD the EU is a society of Nations; where do you see  a society where everyone is equally well resourced? How else does any society deal with inequality except my asking the richer members to contribute more than the poorer ones? How is reducing inequality a sign that stability is threatened or that maintaining inequality is a good way to run a society?

 

If there is a society that is threatened buy it's growing inequalities it is the UK. Social mobility has been decreasing since the end of the seventies. Wages for the lower half of earners have been going down for 10 years and our productivity stubbornly refuses to rise. The average German or French worker can go home on Thursday afternoon and still get the same amount done as a British worker does in a week.

 

Don't lose any sleep worrying about Germany or Greece; it must be a comforting fantasy to think everything will go to hell on the continent soon but we've got plenty on our plate for the next decade.

[Vespasian]

22 minutes ago, WesD said:

Well you will be looking for a long time, the nations within the EU are not on a parity. 

All pay different rates, all being told to take different amounts of immigrants reducing coal power by varying amounts. 

All with varying amounts of debt paying back interest before being able to spend on public services. 

 

Watch Greece with Simon Reeves and Turkey with Simon Reeves, some nations are in to take others are told to give, Germany is far from stable at the moment the EU will end up in a civil war when the rich nations become too elite for the poor within it. 

 

Protecting borders is quite rich seeing that its opened them.

 

We have the UN and NATO to project military power. 

 

Can't seem to find any Utube vids of any length on simon reeves and turkey, but I'd like to watch the TV program,  looks pretty interesting.

 

Anyways, I'm hoping Europe keeps the Turks out of Europe..  They're muslims, they don't belong in the fold.   

 

 

[Vespasian]

36 minutes ago, matelot said:

Over the last few years has Europe "protected it's borders"? IMHO, we wouldn't have voted Brexit if Merkel hadn't invited the third world into Europe.

 

 

 Quite right to Matelot.

 

But I'd like to change how things are done from within the EU, not throw the baby out with the bathwater by leaving what is a very successful trading alliance just because Merkle mucked up..

[WesD]

6 minutes ago, Vespasian said:

 

Can't seem to find any Utube vids of any length on simon reeves and turkey, but I'd like to watch the TV program,  looks pretty interesting.

 

Anyways, I'm hoping Europe keeps the Turks out of Europe..  They're muslims, they don't belong in the fold.   

 

 

It was on bbc mate not sure if it is still on iPlayer. 

[Vespasian]

1 minute ago, WesD said:

It was on bbc mate not sure if it is still on iPlayer. 

Errr cant watch Iplayer..   The spies at the BBC will be onto me and want some money for a licence.

 

After fifty or so letters from them I eventually persuaded them that I only watch Utube these days, which is true..  I don't have a telly anymore..   but you still need a licence to watch BBC Iplayer..    I'm not paying to watch that...    

[WesD]

16 minutes ago, Vespasian said:

Errr cant watch Iplayer..   The spies at the BBC will be onto me and want some money for a licence.

 

After fifty or so letters from them I eventually persuaded them that I only watch Utube these days, which is true..  I don't have a telly anymore..   but you still need a licence to watch BBC Iplayer..    I'm not paying to watch that...    

 I thought you liked to be part of the bigger picture and not be singular and secluded from the world. 

 

Your one of a kind vesp!

 

Ill see if I can find it online for you. 

[arbogrunt]

I'm still intrigued to hear if anyone is pro-Federal European government. The EU is not going to stay what it is now...it's in development. It will have one currency, one Army, one appointed Governing Council...and elected members of a single Parliament. This is what I personally voted against. I'd be interested to hear of someone who really wants the UK to become part of this future Europe?....economies are important but surely Sovereignty is THE most important thing for any Countries future?

[arbogrunt]

...and by the way...I don't disrespect any proEU people's opinions...they are not 'remoaners'....any more than 'Brexiteers' (hate than term too), are jingoistic, nationalistic or raving fascists. All opinions count.