A public "good" must be paid for from the public purse

[Mull]

 

 

 

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[matelot]

I think farming subsidies are one of those things that made sense 50 years ago but not any longer...

 

Obviously during WW2 the U boats nearly starved Britain to defeat. So after the war I could see why politicians were keen for Britain/ Europe to be self sufficient in food. However I don't think anyone can realistically see the UK suffering a naval blockade again...

 

I don't think any of the reasons presented to retain farming subsidies seems particularly strong....

 

Economically farming doesn't really matter to the UK, my perception is that farming provides jobs that pay a poverty wage. If the jobs disappeared I don't see it as a disaster for the UK.

 

Environmentally farming is one of the biggest polluters in Europe (ie slurry discharge into water courses). They get away with derisory fines that no other industry would get away with. Sheep farming absolutely rapes the land of vegetation and trees. Sheep have been described as "locusts" and anyone comparing hills grazed by sheep and natural forests would agree.

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

 

 

 

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I saw that a day or 2 ago on the NFU FB feed.

 

What a quality piece of unsubstantiated propaganda - no stats, no data, no reference, just pure unadulterated propaganda intended to pump up the already grossly inflated opinion (of those within the sector) of the importance / significance of the sector.

 

You'd be better off watching this:

 

 

Or reading this:

 

https://www.pwc.co.uk/assets/pdf/ukeo/ukeo-sectoral-employment-march-2016.pdf

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

 

I don't think any of the reasons presented to retain farming subsidies seems particularly strong....

 

Economically farming doesn't really matter to the UK, my perception is that farming provides jobs that pay a poverty wage. If the jobs disappeared I don't see it as a disaster for the UK.

 

Environmentally farming is one of the biggest polluters in Europe (ie slurry discharge into water courses). They get away with derisory fines that no other industry would get away with. Sheep farming absolutely rapes the land of vegetation and trees. Sheep have been described as "locusts" and anyone comparing hills grazed by sheep and natural forests would agree.

 

 

Para 1 - on the contrary, it's not that they "...don't seem particularly strong..."

 

They are inherently flawed, fail to properly support the elements that might be judged as needing support and disproportionately advantage those that least "need" support. It's a truly scandalous gravy train with biscuit wheels dumping staggering amounts of public money into the coffers of big business and the landed gentry yet it retains the passionate support of the (farming) masses because they can't afford to lose the crumbs that are swept aside from the tables of the privileged.

 

An unbelievable example of suppression (with the active and enthusiastic support) of the proletariat by the bourgeoisie - and this is 2017 UK!

 

Para 2 - economically, fairly insignificant. Not so with regards to resilience, moral and social attributes.

 

Para 3 - Just a matter of time, change will come.

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

 

 

 

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I've got yr range & bearing!

 

You're baiting me 😂

[matelot]

 

 

 

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Does this £7.40 include the economic cost of millions of workers driving to work and getting stuck behind tractors?

[muldonach]

Just about the planning thing it must be different in some areas but my local paper is full of planning applications for farm sheds/slurry towers etc most weeks all going throu PP.

I dare say most won't be refused but i have heard of them altering things

 

In scotland you have a choice-

 

1. You can apply for planning permission

2. You can apply for permitted develeopment rights

 

You cannot do much at all without at least an acknowledgement that you have valid rights

 

Cheers

mac

[Mull]

I've got yr range & bearing!

 

You're baiting me [emoji23]

 

 

[emoji476][emoji476][emoji476][emoji476][emoji476]

 

 

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[kevinjohnsonmbe]

 

Environmentally farming is one of the biggest polluters in Europe (ie slurry discharge into water courses). They get away with derisory fines that no other industry would get away with.

 

 

Para 3 - Just a matter of time, change will come.

 

Interesting piece on Countryfile regarding slurry discharge and nitrate levels in Holland with the farmers being held to account for that which is leached into the water course after slurry spreading.

 

Also of particular interest was the Dutch farmer who outright refused to accept / acknowledge that slurry was a contributory factor in water course pollution!

 

Also of interest, to note the (apparent) lifestyle / business attributes of an EU farmer in receipt of substantial state aid.

 

Why does it bother me so much.....?

 

Firstly perhaps because I witness almost daily, discharge from slurry into the watercourse (contributing to amongst the highest water rates in the country) and less frequently but consistent year on year slurry / fertiliser spreading in close proximity to tributaries that lead directly to the beaches that are so important to the recreational and economic lifeblood of the Cornish economy. Not to mention the blatantly obvious environmental damage.

 

Secondly, because I am completely at a loss to understand, supposedly in an era of austerity, why those that are so far removed from needing state aid are prioritised over so many that perhaps have a vastly more justified need for state assistance.

 

Interesting that the story was covered on Countryfile (apparently pro-ag) where I wouldn't be surprised if the majority of the UK audience were either ignorant or arrogantly dismissive of the subject and the damage being done.

 

Maybe the bad habits are starting to be more broadly recognised. Will be interesting to see if the NFU start a "positive" PR campaign to counter!

[Mull]

Interesting piece on Countryfile regarding slurry discharge and nitrate levels in Holland with the farmers being held to account for that which is leached into the water course after slurry spreading.

 

 

 

Also of particular interest was the Dutch farmer who outright refused to accept / acknowledge that slurry was a contributory factor in water course pollution!

 

 

 

Also of interest, to note the (apparent) lifestyle / business attributes of an EU farmer in receipt of substantial state aid.

 

 

 

Why does it bother me so much.....?

 

 

 

Firstly perhaps because I witness almost daily, discharge from slurry into the watercourse (contributing to amongst the highest water rates in the country) and less frequently but consistent year on year slurry / fertiliser spreading in close proximity to tributaries that lead directly to the beaches that are so important to the recreational and economic lifeblood of the Cornish economy. Not to mention the blatantly obvious environmental damage.

 

 

 

Secondly, because I am completely at a loss to understand, supposedly in an era of austerity, why those that are so far removed from needing state aid are prioritised over so many that perhaps have a vastly more justified need for state assistance.

 

 

 

Interesting that the story was covered on Countryfile (apparently pro-ag) where I wouldn't be surprised if the majority of the UK audience were either ignorant or arrogantly dismissive of the subject and the damage being done.

 

 

 

Maybe the bad habits are starting to be more broadly recognised. Will be interesting to see if the NFU start a "positive" PR campaign to counter!

 

 

What would you replace farmers with Kev? Bearing in mind the effects on the countryside?

Are you a rewilder?

 

 

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