ArbMish

I'm glad to see things are moving..I've been assured that everything is now with the events team so it should be all good. Anyone else seen the email about the Scottish Branch AGM?? ..I'm going to try and go but damn it's far south!

Hey Paul, Did you and Steve get the email I sent over? Cheers

After finally managing to read the entirety of this thread I thought I'd add a little somthing. I agree with beechwood, there seems to be a lack of training after getting tickets within our industry. I can only talk from my own experience of course but here goes.. I'm only in my 3rd year of Arb' specific work and bar college/uni holidays I've always been part time. I've never lied about how much experience I have as I wanted to learn and I didn't see the point in lying about it...you're just gonna get caught out and your employer isn't gonna be too happy with you. Also I always made it clear I was studying horti/arb at college and only working part time... I started with a company that had employed staff of 5/6 with myself added on top of that so a fairly big team (in my experience anyway). The boss wasn't on most jobs (he was transitioning away from doing the heavy work for health reasons I think) but there was a gaffer. I was given pretty minimal 'training' - how to mix fuel, how to use their model of chipper etc. After that, pretty much nothing. Even at times when there would have been 'time' to give such training. For example, I struggled cross cutting larger timber because I had never done it. Sometimes we ended up on yard days because of weather/cancellations whatever where there was the time for someone to show me but it never happened. I just got told to get on with it. I've since left this company and subbed with a few others...I can now look back and say I think part of the reason for lack of training on the job was: the boss not pushing it to happen, time to get jobs done, the guys I was working with not having an awful lot of training either and also all of them not taking into account I was a part time member of staff. There's only so much experience you can gain part time, especially with people who are unwilling to offer advice/training. I now look back and see that I was often expected to know a lot of things without being shown/told etc. I think this company may have been quite lucky with me as I'm naturally very cautious (perhaps too much sometimes), I also tend to keep an eye on everyone I'm working with and I'm studying arb so had a fair amount of knowledge coming in from outside sources..if it had been someone else with a cocky attitude and a less cautious nature then things may have gone south. Toward the end I often found it was me training new staff members on use of the chipper and showing them the hand signals we used...not the gaffer or someone else on the team. I think there needs to be a real push within the industry for training after tickets. As I said I've since worked for a few other companies - I was very choosy who I worked for after leaving the aforementioned company, if they didn't sound like I'd get the training/advice I needed I didn't bother. - I now work with people who recognise I know what I'm doing (to a certain extend) and I have knowledge gained at college but they don't expect miracles. They give me a chance to learn new things whenever possible and they don't expect me to know everything. Likewise they offer plenty of tips and advice and don't make me feel stupid if I don't know something. Not being made to feel stupid I think is hugely important because if you're made to feel stupid at work you're going to ask less questions and do things just by assumption..which I'd say in our industry is pretty dangerous. I overheard a couple of my friends at college talking about a 16 year old kid they'd had in for his first day on the job. They were on about how hard they worked him and how he wasn't very strong. I just thought: ffs this is a 16 year old, what 16 year old is really strong? Unless they're some kind of bodybuilder?! Now that kid may end up feeling stupid and not ask questions where he should.. I also agree with whoever said working in the forest is good for those in Arb I had the opportunity to go into the forest just yesterday and that was some experience! Again with a decent guy who knows the experience would be good for me. He felled the big spruces and I snedded them. We don't deal with an awful lot of big trees in Arb so this was a big learning curve but damn it was a good one! Equally it was great to have someone there to give advice and ask questions of. What I'm saying is I hope that this incident will push the industry to start taking training after tickets more seriously and also knock some of the bravado out - especially when it comes to dealing with those new to the industry. Just my thoughts..

Yep undo the Knut and make sure it goes on the right way. Also keep an eye on the washer, make sure it all goes back together how it came basically. And don't worry I thought exactly the same thing when I got mine!

Perhaps I was remembering wrong and you just have to be registered/qualified to remove it from site. There was definitely something along those lines. But as I said that was a coupla years ago so could do with a memory refresh Yeah I think it says you have to 'manage' it if it's on your land or you could be served an ASBO. The ASBO bit I remember because it makes knotweed sound like a yob haha!

Perhaps I was remembering wrong and you just have to be registered/qualified to remove it from site. There was definitely something along those lines. But as I said that was a coupla years ago so could do with a memory refresh Yeah I think it says you have to 'manage' it if it's on your land or you could be served an ASBO. The ASBO bit I remember because it makes knotweed sound like a yob haha!

I work with a guy who has senna Bluetooth headsets, they're for motor bikes I believe..but they're not hard to fit. I think they're great, they completely change the job!

I think you need to be careful with Knotweed, by law you have to be a licensed contractor to deal with it and it's removal. Because it's capable of regrowing from tiny tiny pieces. As far as I was taught once removed arising needed to be burnt because of that risk. I can't say for sure as I'm not a licensed to deal with it. You can receive an ASBO for not controlling knotweed that's on your property. There are a few strict laws when it comes to dealing with it, I think they're nation wide but it may just be in Scotland. This could have all changed ..it's what I was taught in college two years ago but I can't see them changing it.

I have just spoken to someone at the Forestry College (Inverness) and they are willing to host AA events and workshops! Of course the details will need to be worked out but still great news. I've suggested starting with Duncan's as he's confirmed he would be happy to run his tree forks workshop but if something else's ran first it wouldn't matter. All depends on availability and interest I'm sure. I'll email Steve and I can cc you in too Paul, if you want to send me your email address? Oh and I should have signed this off before I guess... Amy

Hi Steve, Thank you for this. I would be interested to know where the courses in Scotland were held? If you saw the original post one of my main points was the lack of courses held North of the Scottish central belt. Perhaps some were held closer to home and we're just not hearing about them. I would appreciate more advertising of Scottish courses, I read almost every AA email so even an email would work. I do understand that there is little membership in the North of Scotland but it is a bit of a chicken in egg, you won't get the members if you don't run anything close to the North. I would also like to add that the only place to offer an Arboriculture degree in Scotland is in Inverness. I'm in my second year of study at the Forestry College and I don't recall seeing the AA have any direct interaction with the College. We recently had a visit from Gristwood and Toms which was really valuable. If you want to raise your membership in Scotland I would suggest starting here. If people are studying arb' then they are already on the right path to becoming professionals so surely students would be the perfect target audience. Likewise if you collaborate with the college (as I was intending to) then you have a space with the right infrastructure to run events/workshops/talks etc. It may even be free! I'll send you an email about this as well but I thought I'd leave a public comment to allow others to comment. I appreciate your efforts and I'll fill out the survey of course.

Then I guess you have each other Ps: In my experience all tree surgeons smell so that's not a valid reason here

Yes sorry..mind was on something else. Hoping to run it at the Forestry College if possible. Could you spread the word to anyone else who you think may attend.

I missed this reply amongst the others. I agree we perhaps don't need the AA to organise such things. Which is why I contacted Duncan directly and I am willing to organise a venue as well. The main issue is funding, as Duncan said the AA provide the funding for him to do his workshops. The other end of the stick is that we pay for an AA membership and don't seem to be getting much out of it, especially if you are anywhere North of Edinburgh. We're also encouraged to work towards being accredited but again are not offered the workshops/classes/talks etc that would help gain the accreditation. Personally I feel yes you are right we could start are own organisation but we already have one with the groundwork/public awareness/structure/members etc already present, we should be getting the benefit of that. On the other note of this thread, would you be interested in Duncan's workshop if it was run in the North?

Is it not one and the same? If you give those doing the job the means to learn more in order to 'be better at it' (for want of a different way of saying it). Then the standard will be higher, it also means those same people are able to explain to customers why they are doing a certain thing. That knowledge gains respect. When you act like a professional - standards, knowledge etc - you are viewed as one are you not? I'm not saying every customer would listen but there are people like that everywhere. Plenty of times I've explained to customers why I'm doing or not doing something and each time they've listen and been impressed and then passed this on to other people. I'm travelling almost 100miles to go to college to learn more, to be better than 'someone who can use a chainsaw'. However to learn anything outside of college I have to travel to the borders or England. As I understand it a lot of Scotland is made up of small businesses, it's hard to finance the training, travel, accommodation and loss of work to attend something when it's over a hundred miles away. Therefore justifying going is that much harder. I would think if you make courses more easily available then they are more likely to be attended, thus leading to people in the industry having more knowledge/respect. There is now heavy arboriculture involvement in construction where there wasn't before. Protecting root zones for example, in some cases this is now even monitored using TMS. Tree protection is becoming a much higher priority within council planning. Air spading to deal with root compaction in street trees is more widely used, for example. We are behind in Scotland for sure but should we not begin the change at the roots and let it work up?

I would still say that a handful of courses run in a year in the whole..sorry the southern part of Scotland... isn't enough. There is so much talk on improving our industry and making it better respected but we don't get much chance to better ourselves through an association whose main point is the improvement of the industry! Or perhaps that's not what it's for...

Ah you're a David too? It's not cheap but I'd say it's not bad for a day course and it's cheaper if you're an AA member. I've attached the prices for the course running in Preston in December. I'd imagine it would be the same cost. I would remind them that it can be claimed back in their tax

This is good..Davie has a couple, I know of at least three from college if not more and two I work with, Aicchalmers is in and htb you have a couple? So what's that around ten? Davie can you see if your boss could ask around? I'll see if I can get any interest from anyone else I've worked with. Htb do you know anyone else you think would be interested? Aicchalmers reckon some of your class would be as well? I am very determined to make this happen!

Well they ran the HND with only two last year so you'll be fine! Yeah come and look me up Monday and we'll have a chat.. don't worry if I look grumpy that's just the lack of sleep!

Aw awesome! What year are you in? If it's first year..I can tell you it feels like that but you learn more than you would expect for sure! However I do think there could be more, especially on the practical side. Come say hello to me this week..I'm the only girl in the HND year so kinda hard to miss!

I agree with you and that's why I'm not putting this forward as a complaint. I'm going to ask the AA to run the workshop and I'm hoping by doing this I can prove that we'll have the numbers to show them that it is worth it. Duncan is on board to do it and I think I have a location sorted as well so it's just down to funding and that comes from the AA. If you know anyone else who would be interested please point them in this direction

Haha hey Davie!

Excellent, thanks Andy. I feel like there may be more than the AA think. Especially if we help each other out and car share from places that are further away for instance. Like I said I'm based in Aberdeenshire (I just travel to Culloden to study) so I'd happily take 4 people in my car. Lets see what happends.

Hello Hello I've been working in the industry for around 3 years now and I'm in my second year of studying Arb' at Inverness Forestry College. I've been a member of the Arboriculture Association for almost two years and it seems to me that we never seem to have any training/workshops/talks etc from the AA North of the central belt. (Please correct me if I'm wrong.) As a student/arborist in training I would love to attend many of the events/training that the AA put on but the nearest are in Edinburgh or similar. I'm based out of Aberdeenshire so once you include the cost of the course, travel, accommodation (depending on times) and the loss of a days work then it's just too much money. I know guys working full time who are not happy with this either. So I'm hoping some of you will help me change that... I've been in contact with Duncan Slater about giving his Tree Fork Assessment workshop at the Scottish School of Forestry in Culloden. He is willing to do so but his funding comes from the AA. He has passed me the contact details of the relevant person at the AA so I can request that they put on the workshop. I feel the request will be better received if I already have evidence of a wider interest for the workshop to go ahead. Here's a link to an article about Duncans' work: https://www.trees.org.uk/News-Blog/Branch-News/Assessment-of-Tree-Fork-Workshops-announced One of the guys I work for has been to the workshop and highly recommended it to me, which makes me feel it is worth the effort. If any of you are interested can you comment below so that I can gauge how much support there is for this to go ahead. I feel once we've had a successful workshop we may be able to open the gates for more! I'd love to hear your thoughts either way. Cheers in advance Amy

Hello, I'm a self employed groundie with two years part time experience looking for work in the North East of Scotland. I'm based in the Aberdeenshire area but would be willing to travel for the right job. I've just finished my HNC in Arboriculture and Urban Forestry so I am available full time for the next few months and part time thereafter. I have: HNC in horticulture Full Clean Drivers licence and own transport (with ten years driving experience). Tickets 201 Carry out maintenance of chainsaw and cutting system 202 Cross-cut timber using a chainsaw 203 Fell and process trees up to 380mm CS38 Climb Trees and Perform Arial Rescue Woodchipper I am looking to do more tickets when the funds become available. I am used to working on the ground for climbers and MEWPs. I have experience using a tracked chipper, hedge cutting, snedding, crosscutting - mostly small to medium trees, stump grinding, log splitting and some traffic management. I have all my own PPE but no tools at present. If interested please contact me here, or on:07743191943 Cheers Amy