Rope Advance When Using the 'O' Rig

[Joe Newton]

I haven't experienced a friction hitch slip in either configuration, yet, (using the Hitch Climber) but it seems to me thinking about it that it's likely to happen as you place your weight on the hitch prior to taking in more rope during ascent. With the O Rig both hands are below the hitch holding your weight and you're coming onto the friction hitch while still holding with both hands, on the regular set-up by the time you realise the friction hitch is failing to bite you're holding on with one hand above the hitch and the other below the hitch at waist level tending the slack, either way I think there would be a bit of added pressure while it was sorted.

 

 

 

As far as being able to reach the hitch is concerned the distance you can reach forward/above with one hand is greater than the distance you can reach with both hands together as you tend to twist sideways when reaching with one hand so even with the friction hitch in the ascending position and far enough away to allow as much rope to be taken in as possible (waist to full double hand reach) you should (maybe) still be able to reach it with one hand.

 

 

 

Just thinking out loud here and definitely not saying you're wrong

 

 

It can happen either when the hitch gets caught under the top carabiner, or when using an advanced hitch like a loose VT. In standard configuration it's not a problem. I set my hitch out of habit before I load it. When you can't reach your hitch you're left holding onto the rope below the pulley with no way of setting it since you've moved the system out of arms length.

 

Try it. Ascend a bit with your o-rig, then try descending. See if you can do it quickly.

[R Mac]

I agree it isn't as fast to switch between ascend and descend as you need to bring the hitch back in close to descend. I guess that's the compromise.

 

I'll try both set-ups again but I'm still not keen on the idea that I can be left holding with one hand above the friction hitch and one hand below before I find out that the friction hitch isn't holding and it doesn't sound like it's very fluid having to set the friction hitch before loading it every time you advance ( how do you set it before loading it, doesn't it need loaded first?)

[Joe Newton]

I agree it isn't as fast to switch between ascend and descend as you need to bring the hitch back in close to descend. I guess that's the compromise.

 

 

 

I'll try both set-ups again but I'm still not keen on the idea that I can be left holding with one hand above the friction hitch and one hand below before I find out that the friction hitch isn't holding and it doesn't sound like it's very fluid having to set the friction hitch before loading it every time you advance ( how do you set it before loading it, doesn't it need loaded first?)

 

 

It's pretty fluid. When I pull down from above the hitch, I pull all the way down to my hitch. Tend slack with other hand, and with the first hand, whilst still holding the rope, just nudge the hitch upwards with the heel of my palm before letting go.

 

Unless you climb on a loose VT this is probably academic to you.

[R Mac]

'llI definitely give both set-ups a try just as soon as I get a dry day, could take a while considering what it's been like for the past 2 weeks.

[Joe Newton]

'llI definitely give both set-ups a try just as soon as I get a dry day, could take a while considering what it's been like for the past 2 weeks.

 

 

I don't know how long you've been climbing, or using a hitch climber, but I'd say it was best not to jump straight to a VT. Try a Knut or Distel hitch first. More reliable.

[jrose]

Nothing beats the loose VT palm heel nudge technique

[jrose]

I hasten to add that was a joke, and echo what joe said about starting out on a more reliable hitch first!

 

Sometimes I forget this is the Internet and you never know how comments may be taken

[R Mac]

I don't know how long you've been climbing, or using a hitch climber, but I'd say it was best not to jump straight to a VT. Try a Knut or Distel hitch first. More reliable.

 

Tree climbing = only started, climbing = a long time so very comfortable with a prussik.

 

Tree climbing I've only really used a split tail and blakes hitch - didn't work for me either because of the compatability between the climbing line and the split tail or because I'm too light to get it to bite, in any case it kept slipping. I switched to a prussik which was fine and although I tried a prussik with a slack tender I didn't like it.

 

I haven't used anything other than a VT on lanyard and flipline both with a slack tender pulley with no problems.

 

So what is it about the VT that makes it less reliable than a Distel or Knut? it seems like a very popular hitch which is strange if there are inherent problems with it, do the advantages outweigh the disadvantages?

[R Mac]

I hasten to add that was a joke, and echo what joe said about starting out on a more reliable hitch first!

 

Sometimes I forget this is the Internet and you never know how comments may be taken

 

With a large pinch of salt?

[Joe Newton]

Tree climbing = only started, climbing = a long time so very comfortable with a prussik.

 

 

 

Tree climbing I've only really used a split tail and blakes hitch - didn't work for me either because of the compatability between the climbing line and the split tail or because I'm too light to get it to bite, in any case it kept slipping. I switched to a prussik which was fine and although I tried a prussik with a slack tender I didn't like it.

 

 

 

I haven't used anything other than a VT on lanyard and flipline both with a slack tender pulley with no problems.

 

 

 

So what is it about the VT that makes it less reliable than a Distel or Knut? it seems like a very popular hitch which is strange if there are inherent problems with it, do the advantages outweigh the disadvantages?

 

 

Sure they do, for me. The VT is a pretty sporty knot. It's self tends well, and is responsive. It just doesn't always bite, which can be worrying if you're new to the system. I guess it depends on how many wraps/braids you put on.

 

A distel or Knut bites more reliably, making it more suitable to people getting used to the system. Doesn't always self tend as well as the VT though.

 

Forget the o-rig. Get a pantin instead.