Green Party on a green surge....

[Two Acres]

But that's not really what happened, she didn't "shut them down" for the hell of it. These industries were haemorrhaging money and mainly the unions wouldn't let them change or restructure in any way. And as usual after a labour govt the nation was totally and utterly skint so there wasn't money to keep subsidising.

 

The reason the country is skint now is Thatchers deregulation of the banking industry that had maintained stability since the Great Depression. And who are the Tories sking to pay for it with there austerity? You and me. Personally I haen't forgotton about Sir Fred Goodwin, he totally rodgered RBS then cleared off with his £10 million pension at the taxpayers expense while the Tories have, very skillfully, moved the debate away from the bankers and onto welfare. Get the plebs arguing among themselves, divide and rule, all jolly fun :thumbdown:

[Wood wasp]

Again that's not really true, it's was Broon's great spending spree that buggered us and got us in so deep we can't get out. We're still spending 100 billion per year more than we take in and the bank support is long gone.

 

The bank shares will ultimately be sold (some already have) and cash recouped. For the record I'd have prosecuted the bankers who fiddled the books

[wrsni]

it's was Broon's great spending spree that buggered us and got us in so deep we can't get out.

 

With respect, and to quote yourself "that's not really true". Gordon Brown was ribbed continuously during his time as chancellor for being too thrifty and his close alliance with "prudence". The fact is that as stated previously, Thatchers deregulation of the banking industry worked for a while and brought in enough money to boost the state and replace so many of the jobs she destroyed by state funded but totally unproductive public sector jobs. It was only really when the banking industry collapsed that it became obvious that the country had nothing else to fall back on and that is why the national debt still heads inexorably upwards. The situation came to a head under Labour but it has it's roots under Thatchers reign.

 

Maybe should clarify also, that I am most certainly NOT a Labour supporter and sincerely hope they aren't in power in 5 months time.

[Richard 1234]

All governments of the recent past (100 years or so) have spent too much.

If your business spent too much it would fail. The country cannot "fail" as such hence such massive numbers.

We need a business man ( a very good one) running the country for a decade, not the politicians there all as bad as each other.

 

Tin hat time!

[Wood wasp]

Brown followed Tory spending plans originally as per his manifesto pledge. Then he turned on the taps:

 

"After 2000 public spending increased rapidly, with a peak of 45.5 percent of GDP in 2010 in the afermath of the financial crisis of 2008, followed by a slow decrease in subsequent years."

 

Thatcher was actually against bank deregulation but her advisors argued strongly in favour so she conceded. Also worth noting that the supervisory structure was replaced by brown prior to the bank crash.

 

I think it was Canada which also experienced issues with their banks, however they hadn't mortgaged themselves to the hilt in the good days so moved on very quickly.

[skyhuck]

The rewriting of history in this thread is hilarious!!!:lol:

[kevinjohnsonmbe]

I think it was, remember just exactly what state Britain was in when she came to power - we couldn't even keep the lights on!

 

And whether you like her or not, or agreed with her or not she never acted in personal interest but always in what she believed was best for Britain. The historical archives being released confirm this.

 

 

There will be elements of the former industrial communities that will always hate and blame Thatcher for the consequence of the entirely necessary whole scale reform of state subsidised industry.

 

Hindsight's a wonderful thing but so can be blinkered, tunnel vision.

 

Crippling Union intransigence, massive inefficiency, unsustainable and unaffordable state subsidy would have driven the country to its knees anyway. She took the surgeons knife and cut out the cancer.

 

What (it could be argued) she didn't fully appreciate was the long term social, emotional, psychological impact upon the communities that were affected.

 

A legacy of blame and hate that will likely last several more generations. Communities where many generations are without employment, poor housing, crime, drugs and alcohol dependency. Hopelessness.

 

Or was she an inspirational leader? Did she actually preside over a set of decisions/actions that caused pain for some but saved the country from whole scale collapse?

 

I don't expect a former miner, steel or car worker or shipbuilder to ever get over the pain they suffered personally and within their community, but to look back on the WHOLE of the circumstances which brought us to that situation and consider the alternatives (objectively), I'd suggest it wasn't a perfect solution but a necessary one.

 

The flaw was the lack of adequate mitigation for the social impact but looking back at the passion / violence I can't see what would have ameliorated the resistance to change?

[Wood wasp]

Good post Kevin.

 

Of course Thatcher made mistakes but she's head and shoulders over anyone on political scene today.

[wrsni]

Or was she an inspirational leader?

 

No!

 

She was close yes, but played up too much to her own "iron lady", "the lady's not for turning" image which affected her judgement.

 

Holding on stubbornly to an idea that's causing mayhem all around is not a sign of strength, it's a sign of weakness. True strength is the ability to stand back, accept what YOU are doing wrong, change accordingly, and accept the criticism. She could never do that and the country is still paying the price,.....................literally.

[Two Acres]

Here's an article from the Financial Times, (one of my personal favourite sources of information. IMHO a sensible, informed, right of centre viewpoint. It makes it quite clear where the roots of the 2008 financial crash lay:

 

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/7f8aaf08-a122-11e2-bae1-00144feabdc0.html#axzz3Oynwfcb7