when to climber says let it run...................

[dannyT]

5 wraps on a hobbs that must have been a fair old bit of timber LOL

 

It depends how long the groundies been doing the job, when i started grounding ive been pulled into the tree and i have to admit to not letting a branch run and nearly hitting the climber But everyday is a learning day and the more practice the better we become.

 

Have to agree dont leave stubs there a nightmare for groundies when lowering brash.

[Czlowiek Drzewo]

A groundies perspective!

 

I've worked with one or two climbers of varying skill levels in my time, some of whom are easy to work with, and the whole job flows well, Others are soo full of their own importance that they dont need to listen to advice from below. Many factors can make lowering uncomfortable for the climber. Mis-reading the weight of the load, and over-compensating with an extra wrap is the easiest mistake. I trusted a climbers judgement once, and couldnt brake the load on a Hobbs block with 5 wraps, the piece just whizzed down out of control, taking my gloves off in the process, it was too heavy!! More patience and communication is often required between climber and groundie. Give the groundies time to clear the "hole" at the base of the tree, they often have more work to do than the climber!! As a climber, make sure the groundie can see you clearly, and hear you, most mistakes are down to poor communication. Oh, and dont forget to clear stubs that will snag the rigging on descent, saves a lot of grief later on.

So the secret is surely to communicate, practise and plan ahead, not just charge in blindly assuming all will be fine.

 

 

VERY TRUE. usually 1 wrap on portawrap does the job though..you need to get feed back from groudie though...how was the weight on that chunk??

 

like you said communication is the key. So i am of the buy communication headsets today:001_cool:

[coolie]

I am now in the habit of telling the groundies how many wraps to take, so the buck stops here when Im wrong.Id be interested in your comments but I think that your in a better position to make that call from above the block.

[Andy Collins]

In the instance I mentioned, the biggest thing that went wrong was lack of communication. A large piece was safely lowered the night before. I ASSUMED the next morning that the climber was going to carry on in the same vein. The sun was in the wrong place, the mog chipper was running, so I couldn't see, hear or communicate with the climber (not good) Before I knew it he had cut off a monstrous top of cedar. The sound of 5 wraps of line whizzing thru the Hobbs is still clear to me now. Fortunately it dropped straight down the stem on to a pile of tires that were the landing bed. But control had been totally lost due to a simple communication error, and things could have been far worse. Since then I try to clarify the climbers intentions, even if it means delaying the work a little, better safe than sorry.

So its not always just down to the groundie not being switched on, or competance, there is usually a lot more going on on the ground than in the air.

 

Saying all this, I have over-compensated a few times, giving the climber a bit of a shake-up, really tees me off, as letting it run is far easier than it sounds, then just slow it down on its descent so you can guide to log exactly where you want it away from the drop zone, saves unnecessary delays later.

Edited May 5, 2009 by Andy Collins

[Arbocop]

the easiest thing in the world is to over compensate the wraps and also not to communicate.

 

getting that rope to run on a hobbs porta wrap what ver take s a certain skill. whatch the next tiem a groundsman does it, the little slack loop the little flickof the wrist it is art in its self.

 

if you do a igging cource you are taugt and tested or should be, cheak cheak cheak again and go.... not jst go for it

 

so glad no one was too badly hurt, and on a spin off why did it nt run??? new groundsman? new kit? why??

 

kev

[Mesterh]

You know what but tbh I think it is easer to judge when/by how much to let it run when using wraps around the tree. Using portawraps gets a lot of hard to handle fiction imo, maybe I havent used them enough to judge though.

[Andy Collins]

the easiest thing in the world is to over compensate the wraps and also not to communicate.

 

getting that rope to run on a hobbs porta wrap what ver take s a certain skill. whatch the next tiem a groundsman does it, the little slack loop the little flickof the wrist it is art in its self.

 

if you do a igging cource you are taugt and tested or should be, cheak cheak cheak again and go.... not jst go for it

 

so glad no one was too badly hurt, and on a spin off why did it nt run??? new groundsman? new kit? why??

 

kev

 

In our case, I think it was purely and simply the HUMAN element. We had done many rigging jobs prior to this one, Not a lack of training, as all concerned had been on Treevolutions rigging courses and were ticketed up. At the end of the day, if a climber cuts off a piece that is just too big for the system, something must give. I have never ever had as big a piece on the gear since then, at the time I was furious that he had taken such a piece, Sometimes I think that when a boss is the lead climber, he want to get the job done as quickly as possible, as making money is his business. Over-confidence plays a part, on a big t/d, things flow better and better, the temptation to go even bigger to shave more time off the job. I now make sure I can clearly see the climber, and what he is cutting, and will make sure I know where he is cutting to, so I can gauge it for myself. As you say Kev, there is an art to being a groundie, you aint just a brash-dragging rake weilding neanderthal.

[Rod]

like you said communication is the key. So i am of the buy communication headsets today:001_cool:

 

what headsets are you getting and where from etc

[Czlowiek Drzewo]

any idea what headests are gd for price?

[Marc]

I am now in the habit of telling the groundies how many wraps to take, so the buck stops here when Im wrong.Id be interested in your comments but I think that your in a better position to make that call from above the block.

 

I can see your point, this is probably the case for a lot of climbers. The best teams though and this job is one of teamwork not a solo one where the climber is king! should be able to work effciently almost telapathicly together, the climber should have confidence that the groundcrew can read whats happening aloft and react to the situation appropiatly.