Chainsaw update training to become mandatory for all operatives from Oct 2013

[Craobh]

so help me.

 

Help ya??? how???

[slack ma girdle]

Currently fisa only have 5 trainers and they are all up north. Helpfull

[Craobh]

So it been well thought out then

[TGB]

Reading through:

http://www.hse.gov.uk/treework/treework-incidents.htm

 

The HSE recognises that accidents do happen outside professional arboreal operations. But even in the known comparisons, they appear to be lumping all incidents together as one.

 

Of the known fatals and loss of 3days work accidents, spanning 11 years, 24%-33% are private individuals. And not all of these are chainsaw specific accidents. The nature of some accidents, are stated as being struck by a fallen branch or tree..

 

Without viewing every scrap of paper, it's impossible to correlate all. But the HSE were heavily involved with two such incidents, both of which resulted in fatality, when wind-blow trees fell and struck passing children. Then there's fatals, where passing motorists have been struck be falling trees. All to be categorised under arboreal accident stats.

 

Also in the HSE's notes, is this statement, "...It is important to note that a Certificate of Competence is not a measure of experience..."

 

Perhaps the powers that be, have taken the stats. Have not taken into account, that up to 30%+ are outside pro operation and won't be touched by further legislation. And are giving a knee-jerk reaction to the whole.

[TGB]

continued:

 

On paper, in the year 2010-11, the HSE recorded three times the amount of both fatalities and 'non-fatal major injuries' attributed 'members of the public'.

[Craobh]

Good research there bro.

 

 

I'd have to agree with your summation and conclusion it would seem to be a knee jerk reaction.

 

 

Is the folks that produced the first docs posted here trying to get in some ones good books or are they in line for something else??? Or are they trying to out maneuver some one else and claim they are the trail blazers in cleaning up the industry etc etc etc

 

 

But in doing so they might put folks to the wall and actually harm the industry.

[morten]

Morton, how about a 20 % VAT TAX, on nearly every transaction:thumbdown:

Maybe the super high fuel taxes:thumbdown:.

Nothing to make up, or perhaps your so use to high taxes on so many things

another opinion where taxes are very low in comparison does not compute?

FYI, I have visited the UK last year and I can vouch for my opinion.

easy-lift guy

 

The UK has a 20% VAT rate on most (not all) goods. Many other European countries have a 25% VAT on ALL goods.

 

Likewise, the maximum income tax in the UK is 45% (above £150K), whereas many European countries have income tax rates of 50%-56% (at incomes above £60K).

 

Source: Tax rates of Europe - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

An when it comes to fuel duties, the UK is not the highest, either. See Europe's Energy Portal » Fuel Prices, Rates for Power & Natural Gas for documentation.

 

If you look at the taxation of cars, the UK is actually amongst the lowest tax rates (within Europe), see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Car_taxation

 

So I have to conclude that the claim that the UK is the "most heavily taxed country" (your words) is far from being true. You could claim that Northern Europe is the most heavily taxed region in the world, which would be true.

Edited May 5, 2013 by morten

[easy-lift guy]

Morton, the UK is not the most heavily taxed country in Western Europe. It has a ways to go before it catches up with other Northern European nations. My point is that all of the country's in Europe including the UK are over taxed and regulated, IMO. This will continue

to strangle production and service oriented businesses.

easy-lift guy

[morten]

Morton, the UK is not the most heavily taxed country in Western Europe. It has a ways to go before it catches up with other Northern European nations. My point is that all of the country's in Europe including the UK are over taxed and regulated, IMO. This will continue

to strangle production and service oriented businesses.

easy-lift guy

 

I can agree with that assertion. Although you have to take into account what is provided by the increased taxation, such as universal free healthcare, education and unemployment benefits. It is a different way of organising society which has its advantages as well as disadvantages. But one thing is for sure: It leads to misuse, passivity and limits the desire to be an entrepreneur.

 

Sorry for my pedantic and argumentative postings, and sorry for derailing the thread.

[santacruz]

My whole problem with extra training is the NPTC themselves. Could someone explain how they have become the sole recognised assessment of competance for forestry and arb?. Where is the competition to keep prices keen?. What stops them charging what ever they like?.

 

I will tell a story to show where the route of my beef comes from. When all this NPTC thing was starting up they basicly came round the woods looking for assessors, anyway the fella from my area who was chosen to be fair was a very good timber faller, but not a machinery man. He came and spent a day with us to learn how to use the harvester. When an FMOC in harvesting became compulsory a few years later we booked an assessment with NPTC and who turned up, it was this fella. I am sorry but that assessment cost 200 quid and half a day wasted. The whole system needs shaking up.

 

And another thing I know a few NPTC assessors and a few of them travel all round the country in a 4x4 for 1 day of assessing, now if the process was competitive then there would be no way this would be profitable. Would anyone travel 200 miles for one day of tree work?.