Climate change- discuss

[pie eater pete]

yes, thats another facet of human nature, not to learn from others mistakes.

 

"those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it" George Santayana.

[Albedo]

Evening pumpy

 

I think that your first link just proves that the guy couldn't model the atmosphere in an actual 'greenhouse'.

 

The second link is quite good and interesting. The first bit being about furnaces and thermodynamics. The rest being an extrapolation to the actual atmosphere. So mostly as you say not empirical.

 

You do have a point though. Its all based on models as it involves predicting the effect in the atmosphere in the future. However there are all the empirical measurements from Mauna Loa in Hawaii for example, ice cores etc.

 

Until recently climate change theory wasn't a big worry as the predicted climate change was deemed to be way into the future i.e. thousands of years

 

Did we not start to get hot and bothered about it because the predicted effects started to actually occur much sooner than expected.

 

Is there not a permafrost ice tundra in Russia somewhere that has reached its tipping point and is melting releasing methane, an even more potent greenhouse gas.

 

Also is it not accepted that it is these gases in our atmosphere at their current balance that keep the climate liveable in the first place.

 

If the sceptics alternative theory that its all natural cycles, is true then we are due another ice age... Do you have any empirical data as to where our ice age has gone?

 

 

And Look... No links:sneaky2:

[will.morris]

Baffles me as to the amount of people that have such strong opinions on climate change. In short how can you have a thought out logical opinion on the subject unless your a scientist that knows all the ins and outs. Ideas are put in peoples head constantly through media and then people believe it.

 

My view on it: I don't understand it enough because I am a tree surgeon not a climate scientist so I honestly don't have a clue.

 

We may as well be discussing in depth rocket science really, none of us really know what were talking about so it's just people clashing their opinions and some knowing slightly more than others.

 

 

...Honest enough and truthful post guys?

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

I am not for the record a doom and gloom kind of guy, I dont actualy think were more than 40% of the contribution to global warming, but then 40% is a lot on top of normal system fluctuations.

 

The thread is really about discussing or thoughts and feelings regarding this issue, and you have just expressed yours.

 

I think a lot of people are more worried than they let on in all honesty, many of you have children, that would worry me, for their sakes, I mean, what if its all true? doesnt matter whos right and whos wrong, wether its all BS or not, the fact of the matter is The EFFECTS are there, that much is undeniable, question is, will you care enough?

[will.morris]

I am not for the record a doom and gloom kind of guy, I dont actualy think were more than 40% of the contribution to global warming, but then 40% is a lot on top of normal system fluctuations.

 

The thread is really about discussing or thoughts and feelings regarding this issue, and you have just expressed yours.

 

I think a lot of people are more worried than they let on in all honesty, many of you have children, that would worry me, for their sakes, I mean, what if its all true? doesnt matter whos right and whos wrong, wether its all BS or not, the fact of the matter is The EFFECTS are there, that much is undeniable, question is, will you care enough?

 

[Tony Croft aka hamadryad]

The day will come when the petrol pumps and the strip coal mines have to be shut down, and it will happen, so get used to it, the idea I mean, couple of decades and the truth will be less than debatable. The high tide will be lapping at the doors!

[Albedo]

Good honest post Will, perhaps this thread should take another direction. I had decided to stay out of it a bit tonight and let others have their say.

 

And here I am again:blushing:

[John Barleycorn]

If we are talking disaster scenarios, then what about that old volcanic cone on Tenerife ?

Every few thousand year it collapses down into the atlantic & causes a tsuami that wipes out the whole Caribean & the east coast of north america

[will.morris]

Good honest post Will, perhaps this thread should take another direction. I had decided to stay out of it a bit tonight and let others have their say.

 

And here I am again:blushing:

 

Cheers

 

Same for me on another thread about the ladders haha. I always fear that forum debate can be taken the wrong way though sometimes. Nothing I say on here is ever meant as malicious, even when expressing a totally opposite view point. This would be clear face to face probably in the form of banter but is not always obvious online. I come on here to learn from people I respect and to mix with industry professionals, sometimes comparing opinions.

 

Tony I apologise if my first post came across as arrogant, it was not meant as such and I think it is cool how many people are interested to discuss this subject

[Albedo]

Cheers

 

Same for me on another thread about the ladders haha. I always fear that forum debate can be taken the wrong way though sometimes. Nothing I say on here is ever meant as malicious, even when expressing a totally opposite view point. This would be clear face to face probably in the form of banter but is not always obvious online. I come on here to learn from people I respect and to mix with industry professionals, sometimes comparing opinions.

 

Tony I apologise if my first post came across as arrogant, it was not meant as such and I think it is cool how many people are interested to discuss this subject

 

The ladder debate is a far more dangerous place to be than the climate change debate Will.

 

I like your posts though mate and I think your sincerity does come across:thumbup1: