Are logs a sideline or a full time business ?

[Dave Martin]

I'm glad you think like that Skyhuck. It's the differences that make this forum interesting.

The ease of scaleability of any business is a function of how simple it is to describe what is expected from each member of staff. That's one of the reasons why McDonalds is so successful.

I've always liked a challenge, and you're right, a log business would be demonstrably easier to scale. However, I have been working on the scale modelling for the last 10 or so years and seriously for the last 2.

It's complex and difficult and rewarding. I employ intelligent people, most of whom have a professional qualification of one sort or another, (not necessarily in tree work). It does mean that I can, usually, rely on them to carry out the tasks assigned to them without breaking too much and in a timely manner. It also means that I can access their thinking for ideas to make the company better. They get quite bored doing logs and I don't work well with people who don't understand what polysyllabic means let alone spell it.

 

Company looks after staff.

Staff look after clients.

Clients look after company.

Happy Days

 

Ps. Thanks Steve, (assuming that was directed at me. If not, I'll just finish my herbal tea and go to bed)

 

Why?

[Sam Thompson]

I don't work well with people who don't understand what polysyllabic means let alone spell it.

 

 

What the hell has spelling got to do with your productivity?

[Dave Martin]

As you have not yet answered Paul I will jump back in. To me the mind set of a lot of tree surgeons is that `doing` logs is menial. Now if I were you I would have serious words with all these brainy people that work for you and whilst your at it look in the mirror and give yourself a good talking to because by your own admission you give away over a quarter of a million pounds worth of product at retail each year

[gensetsteve]

It would be difficult to run as a main business because there are so many people doing a few loads in November for £40 cash. I know a few people who sell logs in a big way go on holiday for 6 weeks and come back end of November and then start selling their 1000 tonnes. There is a huge market but prices are kept low by the minority and once someone has bought a bargain load of logs in september sets the price for the winter. Sorry If i sound like the robot out of your sci fi thing Dave:biggrin:

[hardtop110]

As you have not yet answered Paul I will jump back in. To me the mind set of a lot of tree surgeons is that `doing` logs is menial. Now if I were you I would have serious words with all these brainy people that work for you and whilst your at it look in the mirror and give yourself a good talking to because by your own admission you give away over a quarter of a million pounds worth of product at retail each year

 

It's about opportunity costs and competencies. By the time you have factored in the additional plant, storage and variable costs in, in (very) simple terms, Paul could earn £10 per hour processing the arb waste into logs, or earn £30 an hour doing tree work - I'm guessing at the exact numbers, but the principle is there.

 

Obviously, this assumes that he is already busy doing arb work and doesn't have the capacity sitting around drinking tea.

 

I work as a management consultant. I could spend the time doing my own books, but I earn more doing my core work than I pay someone to add things up for me - I'm also not very good at it

[gensetsteve]

What the hell has spelling got to do with your productivity?

 

I can just see the job advert. Wanted person to cut up wood. Must have been to school, college and university. Persons under 26 need not apply as they will still be mature students. Applicant must be able to understand all long words and be able to spell them. Experience in forestry not required as training will be given.

[Paul Jenks]

Hardtop has hit some of the nails on the head.

In addition, all our limited yard space, for which we pay, is used for vehicles. We have about 10 sqm for logs, that's about 12'x12'. If we paid for a site to store wood for processing it would have to be accessible all year round and reasonably secure, especially for the processed log storage, (i.e.a barn), reasonably central,(i.e. close to Oxford) and allows fires to get rid of the bark and awful nail riddled lumps that one comes across from time to time.

Of the waste we produce across all sectors, public, commercial and private about 30-35% is left for the client.

A recent example of this would be a roadside job in a rural area for highways. We had a team of 4-6 men cutting back vegetation, using traffic lights, for 20 or so days. They were producing approximately 15-20 tonnes of chip and cord a day. The costs associated with bringing that volume of chip away from site makes it non-sensical. Diesel, wear and tear, men away from site, extra vehicles required, hazards of ingress and egress onto a roadside site. Also, spewing woodchip perpendicular to the road is safer than parallel. And as long as the chip is spread thinly to allow aerobic breakdown instead of anaerobic it's ecologically better too.

Many private clients like to keep the wood resulting from arb operations and for several reasons. They might want the fire wood for them, a family member or a neighbour. We make it cheaper if they keep it, especially if it's in one lump and it's in a back garden. Why spend time cutting something up and mauling it out when you can leave it where it is? Get on to the next job.

Finally, for now, most trees we fell are felled for a good reason. Often that reason is because they are conifers, poplars, willows or knackered. We give all our wood away because the people we give it to know that sometimes they get oak, ash, beech etc and other times they get conifers, poplars, willows or knackered. It's a symbiotic relationship that has served well enough.

[Stephen Blair]

Paul I used to work the same way, now firewood gives me a way of working in the woods and playing lumberjack

I only work very local now so the juicy jobs are limited. I make my money mostly with hedge cutters and polepruners now. That's the cream for me, business wise it's great but it does get a bit boring.

Logs will never make me the money i can make doing a domestic job with a saw or hedgecutter in a couple of hours.

but if I can go and play in the woods with some machinery and get it paid for or at least part paid for with logs then I am happy.

[timtree81]

Paul I used to work the same way, now firewood gives me a way of working in the woods and playing lumberjack

I only work very local now so the juicy jobs are limited. I make my money mostly with hedge cutters and polepruners now. That's the cream for me, business wise it's great but it does get a bit boring.

Logs will never make me the money i can make doing a domestic job with a saw or hedgecutter in a couple of hours.

but if I can go and play in the woods with some machinery and get it paid for or at least part paid for with logs then I am happy.

 

i know steve only to well ,chuging along in the mog ,looking for a reason to take the tractor or tele handler out ,just wish i worked for a huge forestry contractor some times that would pay me £50 g a year that would be so good

[Stephen Blair]

Ha ha, I used to think the same, then 20,000posts later on here trying to give everyone advice I realised overtime I could just practise what I preach.

now I pick and choose my jobs depending on mood, weather and if I can be bothered lol.